Interesting:
Quote:
Originally Posted by T. A. Gardner
The only way I see for the Germans to pull off a "win" in WW 2 is once France falls concentrate on either defeating or getting a peace from Britain period. No invasion of the East. Let the Italians swing in the wing. Concentrate on ending the war you have before starting any new ones.
Also, keep the US out of it. One way to do this is once Japan attacks the US Germany declares war on Japan. It ends Lend-Lease and pretty much halts US operations in the Atlantic. It might even have forced Britain to negotiate a peace.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow Master
This is kinda a goofy what if:
Hitler and the Japanese had promised to co-operate in the wars. When the Germans invaded Russia, the expectation was that Japan would declare war (If not invade themselves) as well. This didn't happen.
On DEC 7, Japan attacks USA (and others).
On DEC 8, USA declares war on Japan.
On DEC 9, Germany declares war on USA.
Japan still doesn't declare war on Russia, and now Germany has to fight the two largest industrialized nations, both at the same time!
But what if:
Germany takes stock of the situation and declares war on japan! Propaganda wise, Hitler has FDR in a deep, dark hole. If Germany makes overtures of alliance with USA Vs. Japan (this costs Germany nothing and prevents USA war on Germany), then the whole war in Europe will have an entirely different future!
Imagine the surprise!
Thoughts anyone?
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When I first posted this I had the dates (for the US DoW on Japan and the German DoW on US) wrong, but I had in mind that Germany would have already taken Briton either in the winter of 1940, or surely by mid summer 1941. Either way, long before US could dislodge their ground and air forces after Dec7.
If Germany had taken Briton by Dec 7, 1940 (a full year before Pearl Harbor), then there would be no excuse for American forces to be fighting in Europe for several years at least. Had the German nation been competent conquerors {read as "no Nazi's"}, British and French shipyards would be cranking out merchant carriers {Large Freighters whose top cargo holds were designed as duel purpose storage spaces/aircraft hangers and roofed with a flight deck}. Millions of French and British infantry troops would be available for any future assault on USSR (if such were even needed) and for expansion of the German empire.
My preliminary thoughts on how the Germans could have made better use of their limited industrial assets too make the most economical war possible have been posted here:
German Tonnage War Strategy
In this tread I tried {and failed, badly} too get across the idea that the BoB and the battle for
control of the North Atlantic could most economically have been fought as one and the same. Read this tread. Understand the concept of evolving the First World War's submarine battles into flying boat-torpedo bombers. With the submarines serving in a support role {as mobile, submersible spare gas tanks} instead of front line combatants. Basically:
Planes are cheaper too build than subs >>> use planes too attack convoys.
Planes are cheaper to replace than subs >>> use subs to pick up downed pilots.
Planes can be built in greater numbers, faster, and with greater security than subs.
Planes can see farther, move faster, and deliver their torpedoes too several different convoys targets each day. Something submarines cannot do.
I have as yet not posted on how the Germans could have made a workable
sealion. That is in the works...
More later.
