What Do You Carry?

Devilsadvocate · #1 (**permalink**) June 28th, 2008, 08:59 PM

The thread about the Second Amendment got me to thinking about what kind of defensive firearms people might carry. For those of us who hold CCW's, what kind of weapons (pistols, revolvers, single shots... etc.) do you carry, and what kinds of holsters do you prefer?

Personally, I prefer a .45 auto and when I carry, it's usually a Springfield Arsenal Model V10 Ultra Compact in stainless steel. This is just a fancy name for an Officer's Model M1911 .45 auto, with a ported barrel to reduce muzzle jump. I use either an inside the waist-band holster or, if I'm not driving far, an SOB holster. My wife favors a stainless Walther PPK in .380 auto when she carries, and uses a special purse with a hidden pocket for it.

Neither of us like to carry a gun unless we are going to be traveling at night, or in remote areas, or neighborhoods we either don't know, or know to be somewhat dangerous. Neither of us have ever had to draw our guns, but several years ago, I did have an encounter with an objectionable young man wielding a large sheath knife when I was withdrawing cash from an automatic teller late one night. I just held my jacket away from my waist so he could see the butt of my .45. I didn't say anything as I did so, just smiled at him. He immediately became very agreeable, put his knife away, and claimed he was "just kidding around".

Kai-Petri · #2 (**permalink**) June 28th, 2008, 09:28 PM

I must say, well at least I believe, most of us Europeans don´t think about these things. One thing is the law forbidding us to carry a weapon, and also we simply don´t think wearing a gun is helping things. I know you believe it differently but simply we don´t believe in having a concealed gun. Weird yes, but that´s just the way it is.

JCFalkenbergIII · #3 (**permalink**) June 28th, 2008, 09:31 PM

Makarov 9x18 in its original shoulder holster. I have a Mauser Broomhandle and holster but the rig is a little too big to conceal LOL.

The_Historian · #4 (**permalink**) June 28th, 2008, 09:41 PM

My Army surplus boots work every time......

Devilsadvocate · #5 (**permalink**) June 28th, 2008, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kai-Petri

I must say, well at least I believe, most of us Europeans don´t think about these things. One thing is the law forbidding us to carry a weapon, and also we simply don´t think wearing a gun is helping things. I know you believe it differently but simply we don´t believe in having a concealed gun. Weird yes, but that´s just the way it is.

I wouldn't expect it of Europeans, the question was mostly for Americans, and holders of CCW's at that. But then, Miguel claims to have been mugged three times, and I've never even come close, so maybe there's food for thought there?

Devilsadvocate · #6 (**permalink**) June 28th, 2008, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The_Historian

My Army surplus boots work every time......

There you go! And you don't even have to worry a bout a holster.....LOL!

Kai-Petri · #7 (**permalink**) June 28th, 2008, 09:44 PM

My tank, naturally....works every time!

C.Evans · #8 (**permalink**) June 28th, 2008, 09:51 PM

I don't have a CWP yet so I don't carry mine-unless it's in the trunk of my car-when im on the way to or fro-from a shooting range. When I do get a CWP, I will be carrying my WWII German Army Walther P-38 which will be on a swivel-rig (I forget the proper name of this thing) on my belt-requiring no holster. I plan on buying at the October gunshow in H-town, both a Swiss made Sphinx and hopefully a .45. After I get my .45, I will get my CWP and use the .45 as my main.

Devilsadvocate · #9 (**permalink**) June 28th, 2008, 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kai-Petri

My tank, naturally....works every time!

I knew things were bad in Finland, but a tank......??? What do the police carry? Tactical nukes?

Kai-Petri · #10 (**permalink**) June 28th, 2008, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Devilsadvocate

I knew things were bad in Finland, but a tank......??? What do the police carry? Tactical nukes?

Sorry for teasing on the subject, my friend, but it´s a very different world before and after squeezing the trigger at a human being and what you have to live with then. That does not come with the instructions list with the gun. I was wondering if you have lessons on that or only on shooting the weapon in the US?

You know I have been to war area for one year ( Bosnia ) wearing bullet proof vest and my "M16" 24 hrs a day and living with a gun is ok but those who had to fire it on duty it´s not that easy in any case.

JCFalkenbergIII · #11 (**permalink**) June 28th, 2008, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kai-Petri

Sorry for teasing on the subject, my friend, but it´s a very different world before and after squeezing the trigger at a human being and what you have to live with then. That does not come with the instructions list with the gun. I was wondering if you have lessons on that or only on shooting the weapon in the US?

You know I have been to war area for one year ( Bosnia ) wearing bullet proof vest and my "M16" 24 hrs a day and living with a gun is ok but those who had to fire it on duty it´s not that easy in any case.

The Concealed Weapons Permit that you have to go through has nothing to do with shooting your weapon. It deals with the law,possible situations and the consequences and what youe rights are for example. Like I said before I have grown up around weapons all my life both military and civilian ones. I have always been taught the pros and cons of using one and the possible consequences. But as always. If I feel there is an immediate threat to my family and friends I would have no problem using what ever weapon I have or is at hand. A "clear and present danger"

T. A. Gardner · #12 (**permalink**) June 28th, 2008, 11:14 PM

Although I do not normally tote, if I do it is a 9mm Beretta. I always also have my work credential that shows I'm "law enforcement" (although I don't really look at my job that way) giving me the right to carry concealed anywhere in the US under the LEORSA (Law Enforcement Officers Safety Act) act. Thankfully, I have never had a situation where I had to use it.

Kai-Petri · #13 (**permalink**) June 28th, 2008, 11:17 PM

What does the term "immediate threat" include? Can you shoot a person who is unarmed in your backyard? Or does the opponent need to have a weapon of some kind like a knife at least?
Example:
If someone under influence of alcohol started to attack me I´d find it hard to explain why I shot the man if he was unarmed. Hitting him yes, but shooting,no.

JCFalkenbergIII · #14 (**permalink**) June 28th, 2008, 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kai-Petri

What does the term "immediate threat" include? Can you shoot a person who is unarmed in your backyard? Or does the opponent need to have a weapon of some kind like a knife at least?
Example:
If someone under influence of alcohol started to attack me I´d find it hard to explain why I shot the man if he was unarmed. Hitting him yes, but shooting,no.

If he is obviouly armed and makes a motion to aim his weapon at me or some other aggressive action, yes I would shoot him. With no regret. Knife,gun,screwdriver,hammer,boxcutter,ect. There is the also use of the term "Fear of immediate bodily harm" too. If he is obviously unarmed, and sometimes that is hard to tell, along with telling if someone is drunk or not, I would verbally warn him and if necessary fire a warning shot. After that it would depend on his actions. I would certainly use my rifle or pistol to fend them off first.

JCFalkenbergIII · #15 (**permalink**) June 28th, 2008, 11:38 PM

In the incident where the intruder was entering my house and was obviously armed and had pointed his weapon at me I would have been in "Fear of immediate bodily harm" and would have shot him. His mistake. Luckily he was smart and realize that he was outgunned and gave up. I had also had my Remington 870 12 gauge Express shotgun in the room. He really had no chance. If he had been unarmed or armed I would have made sure he was not going to harm me and kept him covered just in case till the police arrived. If he had attacked me? Once again. His mistake. But he would have gotten the rifle or shotgun butt first and as another resort the SKS bayonet.

Devilsadvocate · #16 (**permalink**) June 28th, 2008, 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kai-Petri

What does the term "immediate threat" include? Can you shoot a person who is unarmed in your backyard? Or does the opponent need to have a weapon of some kind like a knife at least?
Example:
If someone under influence of alcohol started to attack me I´d find it hard to explain why I shot the man if he was unarmed. Hitting him yes, but shooting,no.

In all seriousness, anyone who carries, or even contemplates picking up, a gun should think about the potential consequences of actually using it against another human being. There are, of course, the legal ramifications, but also he ethical and emotional issues that one needs to consider. People who have been in war zones have probably thought long and hard about pulling the trigger when another person is in their sights, but they are not the only ones and one need not be a combat veteran to be mentally prepared to use a gun in self-defense.

As far as the legal niceties are concerned, the law in this country generally allows a person to use deadly force when he or she is reasonably in fear of his or her life, or of great bodily injury at the hands of another, whether that other person is armed or not. The circumstances may vary; a physically weak, 100 lb. woman, trapped in a locked room, may fear for her life when facing a 6'3", 250 lb. unarmed man, whereas a healthy man with a similar physique, and a chance to retreat to a place of safety, may not. The law generally assumes that a homeowner, in his own house, may use deadly force against an intruder, no matter what other circumstances may apply. Each case is judged on it's merits, so it's difficult to state hard and fast rules. But if a person is not the aggressor, and genuinely and reasonably fears for his or her life, deadly force is justified. One may also use deadly force if it is reasonably believed to be necessary to protect other's lives.

Even if you are not culpable under criminal law, someone who uses deadly force may still be sued for wrongful death in civil court, so before shooting someone you better make sure that it is a last resort and the only alternative to being killed or badly injured. Having said that, there is a saying in this country; it's better to be tried by twelve, than carried by six.

To answer your question, you may not use deadly force against someone who attacks you, unless you reasonably believe that person intends to kill or seriously injure you, and that the person has the capability of doing so. Even under these circumstances, some jurisdictions require that the person being attacked must retreat if that can safely be accomplished, others have abolished this requirement.

JCFalkenbergIII · #17 (**permalink**) June 29th, 2008, 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Devilsadvocate

In all seriousness, anyone who carries, or even contemplates picking up, a gun should think about the potential consequences of actually using it against another human being. There are, of course, the legal ramifications, but also he ethical and emotional issues that one needs to consider. People who have been in war zones have probably thought long and hard about pulling the trigger when another person is in their sights, but they are not the only ones and one need not be a combat veteran to be mentally prepared to use a gun in self-defense.

As far as the legal niceties are concerned, the law in this country generally allows a person to use deadly force when he or she is reasonably in fear of his or her life, or of great bodily injury at the hands of another, whether that other person is armed or not. The circumstances may vary; a physically weak, 100 lb. woman, trapped in a locked room, may fear for her life when facing a 6'3", 250 lb. unarmed man, whereas a healthy man with a similar physique, and a chance to retreat to a place of safety, may not. The law generally assumes that a homeowner, in his own house, may use deadly force against an intruder, no matter what other circumstances may apply. Each case is judged on it's merits, so it's difficult to state hard and fast rules. But if a person is not the aggressor, and genuinely and reasonably fears for his or her life, deadly force is justified. One may also use deadly force if it is reasonably believed to be necessary to protect other's lives.

Even if you are not culpable under criminal law, someone who uses deadly force may still be sued for wrongful death in civil court, so before shooting someone you better make sure that it is a last resort and the only alternative to being killed or badly injured. Having said that, there is a saying in this country; it's better to be tried by twelve, than carried by six.

To answer your question, you may not use deadly force against someone who attacks you, unless you reasonably believe that person intends to kill or seriously injure you, and that the person has the capability of doing so. Even under these circumstances, some jurisdictions require that the person being attacked must retreat if that can safely be accomplished, others have abolished this requirement.

Exactly DA

.

Slipdigit · #18 (**permalink**) June 29th, 2008, 02:24 AM

I now carry a Rossi .38 revolver, usually in a shoulder holster or fake fanny pack. When I didn't work on the AF base, it stayed in the truck 24/7. I now have to leave it at home. I only carry it now when traveling to other towns and when driving at night. I have carried it parties in the downtown area, under my jacket as we would have to walking a block or two from the parking areas. No one ever knew I had it and I am sure that I was not the only armed person there.

In Alabama, you have the right to defend your property with deadly force, whether you are in fear of your life or not. I have no qualms about putting rounds in the 10-ring of some perp if it will protect my children.

A concealed carry permit was easy to get. I went down to the sheriff's office, filled out paperwork, paid my $20 and it showed up in the mail about a week later. I do not have to have a permit to carry the gun in the open, just if I conceal it on my person or have it in a vehicle nor do I have to have any permit to own a weapon. If I were to hang a pistol on my hip like a cowboy, I could walk down any sidewalk, except near schools. When I was in high school in the late 70s and early 80s, we would bring our guns to school with us if we had been hunting before school. They were visible in our vehicles and nothing was ever said. The school admins knew that if we did anything stupid with them, our fathers would kick us into the next month. But then, we all brought pocket knives to school too.

I guess it all is what you grow up with and are accustomed to. We've always had weapons, but certainly do not handle them in a flippant, childish way.