Alright you guys, show me your knowledge.

I'm looking for any information (web sites, places to call, people to talk to, anything) about my Uncle and his B-17. He died when I was young and never had a chance to talk to him. My Mother, before she died told me a few things but she was in the dark about a lot of things. I have some info and a few momentos (photos, patches, medals/ribbons and Capt. bars) but that's about it.

-His name was Issac Vanmeter Armstrong. I have his date of birth but no serial number
-Was in the 8th AAF
-Rank of Capt.
-Pilot of a B-17. The crew photo shows a B-17G with the number 7340 on the port bow (that's the left front for you non-MC and Navy sons of a gun).
-Shot down twice. Both times over France. Escaped both times with the help of the French Resistance.
-I have a photo taken by his starboard (Right side, see above) waist gunner of his wingman. The tail marking has a black square with a white "H" if I remember correctly (I put the photo away so I wouldn't lose it. Now I can't remember where I put it. It's hell getting old). 388th BG? I'll correct this if need be when I find the photo.
-According to my Mother the name of the B-17 was "Limping Lou." His wife's name was Louise but no one ever knew what the "limping" was about.

Can anyone help or tell me where to go (I'm sure some of you will tell me where to go ).

Thanks
Gunny

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Semper Fi

Hello Gunny

IF the B-17 had a 'Square H' on the tail, then it was certainly the 388th BG flying out of Knettishall.

As with most 8th AF Bomb Groups, they have a good website which can be found at ; -

New Page 1

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"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson

Seems he had at least one prang on British soil too :
(I assume that's his serial number at the beginning?)
Accident Reports.com - USAAF Aircraft Accidents in the United Kingdom and Ireland

Cheers,
Adam.

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It's only the Internet.

This is great. What BG was stationed in Rattlesden, UK? Any idea what the numbers after B-17G are all about?

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Semper Fi

It's really not my thing I'm afraid Gunny, but I'd guess that was the airframe number. Martin and the other planiacs should be able to give you a more solid answer.

Cheers,
Adam.

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It's only the Internet.

Thanks. A search shows the 447th BG (heavy). It's tail marking is a square "K".

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Semper Fi

And here are a couple of pics of Rattlesden, taken on my last visit a couple of years back.....

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"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson

And the very good 447 BG site carries a picture of 42-107060 taken after its mishap at Rattlesden ( you'll need to scroll down almost to the bottom of the page ) : -

Aircraft Gallery

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"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson

Take a quick look at this: NARA - AAD - Display Full Records - Electronic Army Serial Number Merged File, ca. 1938 - 1946 (Enlistment Records)

If the information seems to match up for you, then you can go here to find out what is needed next. But perhaps others can be of more value to your search.
How to Request Military Service Records or Prove Military Service (DD Form 214, DD-214, DD214

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Anyone who clings to the historically untrue--and thoroughly immoral--doctrine that 'violence never solves anything'... Violence, naked force, has settled more disputes in history than has any other factor, and the contrary opinion is wishful thinking at its worst. Breeds that forget this basic truth have always paid for it with their lives and freedoms." Robert Heinlein

Lovely stuff, nice to think of Gunny's Uncle filling out the forms and making the explanation to the CO about that very aircraft.

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It's only the Internet.

Martin, thans for that link!
After my recent walk thru a B17, I'm fascinated with aricraft lately! So it's great to see all these great pics!

Gunny, best of luck on your search! I'll be looking for more!

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...this army made up of ex-resistence men and named by the Prince Himself, became known as the STOOTTROEPEN(Stormtroopers).
Nulli Cedo = I'll give way to no one.

Scott

There's almost a complete thread about Rattlesden today on the Forum ; here's the link : -

8th AF Airfield visit.....

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"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson

Guys, all of you have been a great help. You don't know how much this means to me. All of you have done in two days what I've been looking for off and on for years.

One (yeah, right) more question. Now that I have my Uncle's serial number where can I go to get more informaton?

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Semper Fi

Hi Gunny, it seems your PM box is full aready,(ive been a member for months and only have 5 or 6) so I looked at the link Adam gave earlier and it appears that those numbers in front are the date of the incident.

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Anyone who clings to the historically untrue--and thoroughly immoral--doctrine that 'violence never solves anything'... Violence, naked force, has settled more disputes in history than has any other factor, and the contrary opinion is wishful thinking at its worst. Breeds that forget this basic truth have always paid for it with their lives and freedoms." Robert Heinlein

I'm going to clear it out. I went to the site you showed me and saw the serial number on the first line (I'm a real Einstine).

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Semper Fi

If you'd like to do some reading about the 447th, the Group has been well-served by two splendid books : -

'447th Bomb Group History' by Doyle Shields and Men of the 447th ( published by the 447th BG Association )

and

'Pictorial Tribute To The Men And Aircraft Of The 447th Bombardment Group (H)' by Derek Smith ( published 2006 by East Anglia Books ).

The second book is literally a visual feast, it includes hundreds of rare photos ( some in colour ) as well as many views of the airfield.

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"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson

Thanks again guys.

So, I'm looking for the picture I mentioned earlier and what do I find?

I've now got a picture of my Uncle standing next to the prop of what appears to be a P-51 Mustang. Other then a few exceptions, I thought most pilots stayed where they were? Any ideas. I'll try to scan the photo and post it in a day or two.

The Mustang has a checkerboard cowl. ???

Gunny

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Semper Fi

Any ideas about the crash places in France + dates? If they occured near my hometown I could possibly help. This would be an area comprised between the Seine and the Loire Rivers. I have a lot a of info about Ressitants. Your story is interesting because the odds of beign saved twice were very small. Many have one experience, only a few were saved twice.

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Skipper,
I remember when I was a kid (a million years ago) My brother and I asked him how many times he was shot down. My Uncle didn't say a word but held up two fingers. The story I got about the resistance was from my Mother (his sister).

Here's the story:
After a raid inside Germany, he was shot down by enemy aircraft. The B-17 was going down but still controllable. He gave the order to bail out and he would try to land the bird. Being still inside Germany nobody wanted to bail and told him they would rather stay and take their chances. The plane was limped into France where he sat it down in a field. When everyone got out they noticed movement in the treeline. The crew got ready to fight when they noticed the people coming out were French and as it would turn out were members of the resistance. They in turn got them back to England.

That was the story as told to me by my Mother. She couldn't remember the story of the other mishap.The thing that was really impressed on her mind were the resisiance saving him twice. She refered to them as his "Guardian Angels."

I found a mention on the 447th web site of him being shot down on Jan. 8, 1945 and forced landed in Laon, France. This during a bombing run to or from Frankfurt, Germany.

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Semper Fi

There was quite a lot of 'visiting' among 8th AF Stations. There was a real bond of friendship ( as well as the inevitable friendly rivalry ) between the 'Little Friends' and 'Big Friends' and the fighter jocks would often 'beat up' bomber bases and also often 'drop in' to visit. Likewise bombers would sometimes visit the fighter stations and would also land at fighter bases for operational reasons.

If the full cowling of the P-51 is checkerboared, it could be from either the 78th FG ( Duxford ) or 353rd FG ( Raydon ).

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"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson

I will have to dig this. Laon (Northern France) was already liberated on Jan 8th 1945, so the crew landed in a friendly area. I suppose the first crash happened in 1944 or 1943 in occupied territory. Therefore I think your father was helped by Resistant fighters the first time (date unknown)

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