Sgtleo Here

Anyone who says he saw a Tiger at Rennes is mistaken.

 

Because records are never wrong, apparently.

 

Keep digging. I have a friend who lives just outside Rennes and for Years now he has been researching the use of Tigers in Normandy. I would say he is one of the foremost 'experts' in this area and he would know if there was one 'pushed into the river' (by the way has anyone bothered to look at the number of Bridges in Rennes?) He has managed to find information on single Tiger wrecks as far away as The Somme so I think we can accept that he could find one in his local town. There is no Tiger in the river. There was no Tiger pushed into the river. It never happened.

By all means keep giving us the benefit of your great experience in this area............

 

One last time; only one of you was actually there in 1944.

 

One more time it was impossible for there to have been a Tiger at Rennes.

 

for those wishing to learn more about Rennnes see:

Patton's Vanguard: The United States ... - Google Book Search

All the relevant pages are there and the missing piece on page 61 is a large photograph (I have the book)

 

I have just checked the history of 79th Infantry Division
79th Infantry Division In WW II
and it says the Division took Lassey on 27th July and Laval on August 6th. Laval is some 35 miles East of Rennes. There is no mention of any entry into Rennnes and by checking the 8th Infantry Division records
Regimental history of the 28th Infantry Regiment, 8th Infantry Division.
you see that they are the ones who are documented as entering into Rennnes.

Extract:
"Driving relentlessly south from Avranches, the Division [8th Infantry Division] had seized the key communications city of Rennes by nightfall of 3 August. Here, for the next ten days, the Division dug in for the valiant defense of this nerve center which was vitally important to the success of the Allied offensive. While they were still carrying out this tremendous mission, the Division's 121st Infantry Regiment was temporarily attached to the 83rd Division to take part in the fiercely bitter fighting then going on in the St. Malo area."

?

 

I think that's a fair comment. Don't forget that many German tanks were misidentified as 'Tigers' throughout the Normandy and Ardennes campaigns - PzKw IVs and Panthers especially.

 

sgtleo I have been in touch with my friend from Rennes and he sent me these grabs of the Liberation. Do you recognise anyone?








Check these sites for a few more pics. There is an interview with Col. Wood :
1940 - 1944


La Libération de Rennes Archives municipales de Rennes

If you let me know the location of the bridge where the Tiger was last seen he will get some modern day comparison pics for us. He should also be able to research the local Archives and find when it was raised-it certainly is not in the river today. I am informed there was very little fighting in the city itself and thus this Tiger would have been big news indeed.

 

MODERATORS:-

I would respectfully ask that you read this post (it's long) in
it's entirety since in my opinion one of my posts, ergo my
integrity, has been challenged to the nth degree by m kenny.
A really close read will reveal how ludicrous some of his
commentary is-- e.g. he posted a group of photos and asked
me "sgtleo I have been in touch with my friend from Rennes
and he sent me these grabs(British term for snapshot) of the
Liberation. Do you recognise (British Spelling) anyone?". These
photos are over 68 years old and I wasn't in that town for but
a short period of time. I'd wager there are many with photo
albums of relatives and friends that can't name every individual
in the album but I'm willing to wager he won't quit with the
questions, his versions etc.

I have reflected sufficiently about this matter and reluctantly I
ask you to please consider this my resignation and final word on
the subject. If you agree 4.0 if you don't 4.0.

MY REASONS START HERE:-
I have been noticeably absent from this Forum for a couple of
days since my #1 Priority required my services. In October 2005,
my wife had her left Ventricle Heart Valve replaced and the
operation went awry so that since that time, I think it is 1097
days, I have had to be with her 24/7 to do the mundane things
like button her blouse, tie her shoes, help feed her, make sure
she it properly medicated as prescribed etc. I do this willingly
since I know if the tables were reversed she would be the
Primary Care Giver. This does not permit a lot of free time yet
after 60+ years of marriage that is MY primary responsibility.
I don't have time for debates.

To lessen the stress and prevent a burnout, I turned to My PC
for diversion.

SECONDARY REASON:-
Prior to coming to this Forum I was on another that was slowly
taken over by "Well-Read Intelligencia" that began to question
any/all data presented just as it is now happening here. Sort of
like the child that continues to persist with the question "Why"
regardless of the answer given. Gradually the "Intelligencia" took
over and one by one the Vets began to disappear since more
questions could be/were asked than a Vet(s) could respond to.
We even got down to the level that we were asked "what did you
do with your Gas Mask Case after you threw your Gas Mask away".

Deeply profound WW II data. Cannot/will not go down the same
road again.

ITEM:-m kenny seized upon the Tank Incident and railed loudly
that the 79th ID was not there. He's right!!What I said however
was "my platoon etc.(NO UNIT identification was given)...... and
later on I said "Called the CP and asked for a disposition for the
Tiger and the INTELLIGENCE OFFICER replied "Get rid of it ASAP"-
I often wonder if it's still in that river after it was slowly run off
the bridge by us". Show me, I ask him, where I mentioned the
79th ID!!

A 20 year old newbie soldier,in the dark of night, facing
a Kraut Tank, fearing for his life, is told "We stole this Tiger" and
thus he accepts that info as these FFI guys had been fighting
the Krauts much longer than we had. So we accepted it.

Also there is another possibility - m kenny stated "No Tigers were
in that part of France" - did he ever hear of the rule of exception?

ITEM:-Did I recognize the bridge? In those days we were going
through town and villages like S**t through a tin horn. We did
not have the luxury of taking notes or sitting down reading about
the action like m kenny is now doing - we were too busy because
we were engaged in combat and concerned with staying alive!!!!

ITEM:- I stated earlier "Started out in 79th ID. Made the mistake
of talking to the locals in Normandy and then some of the POWS
before the breakout of Normandy in mid July 1944. Didn't know
some Intel Officers were there specifically looking
for interrogators/interpreters and just like that I went with an
MP BN and the very next day to an Intel Company at Lucky
Forward(3rd Army Hq.)". Didn't even get to unpack my gear.
Raised H**l with my #201 file. Question for m kenny - How
could I still be in the 79th ID on Aug. 1,1944???

ITEM:-When asked for a WWII photo I posted it with no claim that
I was in any way,shape or fashion connected to it!! You showed
how much you knew with the details connected to the photo.

RECAP:-
Since I consider you(m kenny) to be a clone of the
"Well-read Intelligencia" on the other Forum this will be my last
word to/for you and the Forum is yours to destroy as the others
did on the other Forum. You have the bone between your teeeth
and will not let go. Allowing you to be so openly sarcastic and
opionated assures me that I don't need/want this aggravation.
Your remarks to me bordered on a personal attack.(WHY!!)
I am positive in my own mind that you'll ride this horse as far
as you can to demonstate your superior knowledge and my
so-called errata.

Sgtleo

 

Well you said you were in your earlier post #10 of September 29th, 2008, 02:17 AM

Now you say:

Which is it?

 

m kenny:-

This I added to the Summary Chronology of the 79th ID at
that point, which I admit after much time recollecting, that
this part of my unit's history was not the place for that
notation to be inserted i.e. "It was about this time I was
transferred out to the MPs as an Interpreter/Interragator
then up to Intel".

I KNOW that I was transferred to the 3rd Army Intel in mid
July but must confess that I can't give you a specific date
at this moment. 84 years of age can do that you know!!!
Also trying to recollect 281 days of combat at this date in
2008 is extremely difficult after some 64 years. Many other
BTDTs have told me they are surprised at what I do recall.

So for gloating purposes you can say "Gotcha'" and sleep well
tonite.

For your edification and anybody else that may care to read
this you DID NOT SCARE ME AWAY. As I had mentioned, I have
been caring for my wife 24/7/365 since 10/10/2005 and it just
so happened that my health snapped at that time and I have
been hospitalized for several related reasons and only returned
home last Friday. Weight loss, fatigue, stress at watching your
wife approach her death each day are parts of my problems.

According to three Drs. they rated my recall over 95% accurate
after hospital tests despite my problems.

Right now I am in the process of changing my life style or face
the truly dire consequences.(Dying is one of them for example).

Just wanted to let you know I still detest your apparent life style
and remember the old saying "What goes around comes around".

Please no response - I am sick enough without more BS from you!!

Sgtleo

 

Hi Sarge -- I am glad you are back on the forum and wish you well with your health concerns.

Be well!

 

You could clear it all up in seconds.
Nominate someone trustworthy here and send them your service details
Once they check it out all the problems are solved.

That said there was no possible way there was a Tiger tank anywhere near Rennes.

 

m kenny


you have the unmitigated gall to tell me what to do??

I'll revert to my old Top Kick days and say "STFU" - get it!!!!!
nobody has appointed you as an authority I must obey.

You can beat that drum all day about the Tiger Tank(s) but
remember you know only what you read or have been told.
I lived WW II!!!!!


Sgtleo

 

Did I imagine the bit where the forum rules said "respect must be shown to veterans"?

 

Really?

There were 4 Units serving in France in 1944 that had Tiger tanks

sSS PzAbt 101 (45)
sSS PzAbt 102 (45)
Heer sPzAbt 503 (33 TI, 12 TII)
(fkl) 316 (2 TI, 5 TII)

There are 3 books that you need to consult.

For SS 101

http://www.amazon.com/Michael-Wittm...=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1225071185&sr=1-2



For 503

http://www.missing-lynx.com/reviews/german/503/503.htm

SS 102
http://www.amazon.com/Das-Reich-Tigers-Wolfgang-Schneider/dp/B000NPLBF0

They are all quite detailed and compiled with the help of veterans from the Units. There are no better sources for Tiger Units on the market. Not a single Tiger was detached for service so far away from its parent Unit so any stray would have had to have been captured around Caen. Such a prize would have to have been driven unoticed through 150-200 kilometres of German held territory when the British lines were a mile or two away.................
The (fkl) 316 Tigers never took part in any action until Paris was reached we can rule them out.

For August 1st-3rd

SS 101 was fighting around Cintheaux
SS 102 was engaged in a bitter struggle with 11th AD at Chenodolle
Heer 503 were defending around Plessis Grimoult
Only one of these Units was within 150 Kilometres of Rennes

Respect has nothing to do with it.
It must another lapse of memory because it is simply impossible.
I might add that the option remains for those who say it happened to show where this Tiger came from, something they have not even tried to do.

No record in Rennes of a Tiger being in the town...........
Certainly no Tiger was recovered from the River...............
No Tigers within 100 miles of Rennes..........
confusion as to the location and date of the incident.......
doubt as to the identity of the MP Unit/Infantry Division involved....

 

I feel somewhat embarrassed, since it was me who suggested to Sgt Leo that he join the forum.

Steve W.