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Average Tank Battle Distances

Discussion in 'Armor and Armored Fighting Vehicles' started by clueless_newbie, Nov 16, 2014.

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  1. clueless_newbie

    clueless_newbie Member

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    O mighty gurus of WWIIF, who know so much more than me,

    does anyone have some figures for average armor engagement distances for Desert, France 1940, 1944, Soviet, Germany 44-45?.

    Thanks!
    :S!
     
  2. LJAd

    LJAd Well-Known Member

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    a clarification would be advisable
     
  3. LRusso216

    LRusso216 Graybeard Staff Member

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    This might help a little.
    • A US study found the average range for WW2 tank to tank combat between Jun-1944 and Dec-1944 was between 750 and 900 yards, with a mean of 840 yards. Engagement at ranges beyond 1300 m were uncommon (presumably because of the liimted effective range of the most common US tank guns). Another study found the average range of a Western ETO tank battle was 785 yards(One yard is about 0.9144m)
    http://forum.worldoftanks.eu/index.php?/topic/308133-combat-distance-according-to-serb/
    I realize this is a game site, but the study seems legitimate.
     
  4. clueless_newbie

    clueless_newbie Member

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    Thank you!

    Any figures for other Fronts?
     
  5. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    those stats sound very logical...that's the average....I would think the German heavy tank guns would be able to hit at longer range?any experts out there on the Tiger and Panther gun range??ty for replies, and ty for the interesting post
     
  6. Karjala

    Karjala Don Quijote

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    In Finland a lot less, since the forests usually limited the visibility range.

    This clip is from the Finnish war movie "Tali-Ihantala", but the tank battle distances should be correct.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=htnHGJMNjn8

    The movie itself is unfortunately not one of the greatest of films, since it is a kind of dramatized documentary = there's no real story, except of course the battle itself.
    Also one needs to know pretty much already beforehand to understand the events, because the film does not explain enough.

    Luckily they have used some real equipment (T-34, StuG III).
     
  7. KJ Jr

    KJ Jr Well-Known Member

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    Good point.
     
  8. KJ Jr

    KJ Jr Well-Known Member

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    I have to tell ya, at times when researching some info, especially on mobile vehicles and aircraft, I tend to land on those game sites. Tremendous amount of research goes into the making of the games nowadays.
     
  9. von Poop

    von Poop Waspish

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    I've got the official view on this stuff somewhere from OR groups, but a bit of file digging has drawn a blank.
    Definitely depends on theatre. eg, In the desert, engagement ranges were often head-on & at maximum (which led to some assumptions which perhaps caused problems for machines used in Europe.)

    Ah, hangon, I'm sure Buckley has a section on engagement ranges.
     
  10. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    they actually give the kill range when someone gets killed......
     
  11. Fred Wilson

    Fred Wilson "The" Rogue of Rogues

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    It varied with the stage of the battle.

    Allied (ie Sherman) and Soviet (ie T34) strategies were based on overwhelming numerical strategies and speed that would allow
    sufficient numbers of their tankers to break through in sufficient numbers close enough to Axis forces to be effective at that range,
     
  12. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    so, a possible realistic scenario,<> a German tank would be caught where it really couldn't withdraw, so the range would be closer because the Allied forces would have assaulted/surrounded the tank?
     
  13. von Poop

    von Poop Waspish

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    Firstly, can we put aside the above rough assumption about Allied tank deployment being purely a numbers & speed game.
    It's an insult to the men & their commanders to see tactical deployment of armour in such crude terms. They weren't stupid, and wished to survive as much as the next poor bugger.

    Range references in the Excellent 'British Armour in the Normandy Campaign' ~ Buckley:

    Very much a question of how long is that piece of string.
    Also bear in mind that this commentary is largely related to Normandy. As said above, every theatre was different.
    The loss figures for Allied tanks against HV guns are bad, but at the ranges in the Bocage, many postwar tanks would have fallen to those guns at those ranges.
    The loss figures for German tanks counter-attacking (as was their wont...) are also dreadful. Nice front armour on your Panther, but in real terrain the flanks might as likely be exposed to a point blank shot as to a long range one.

     
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  14. Martin Bull

    Martin Bull Acting Wg. Cdr

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    As Adam says, there are many variables. But there was an incident during the Bulge near La Gleize where a Tiger II knocked out a Sherman at approx 2,000 yards . The Sherman was unaware and silhouetted on a ridge-top, while the Tiger was on the valley floor below, so it's not really an 'engagement', more target practice. Impressive shot, though - and the optics must have been very good.
     
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  15. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    i would think the optics would be more than adequate for the gun...or was it the other way around?? anyone?
     

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