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Great Britain makes peace with Hitler in 1940

Discussion in 'What If - European Theater - Eastern Front & Balka' started by British-Empire, Mar 2, 2008.

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  1. PactOfSteel

    PactOfSteel Dishonorably Discharged

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    Thats how it would have played out if England would have capitulated. Like I've always said they shouldn't have given up on England.
     
  2. macrusk

    macrusk Proud Daughter of a Canadian WWII Veteran

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    Agreed. Also agree that Alaska would not have been in isolation. Canada would certainly have been preparing itself and have Allied itself with the US. Just because Great Britain might have signed an armistice with Germany in your scenario, British-Empire, there would be nothing stopping it from changing its mind. Canada was the training ground of the Commonwealth Air Training Plan and most certainly would have been geared up in the same manner in your scenario as it was in reality. Canada would then be a launching area and supply location on both Atlantic and Pacific for Britain's Navy - also for America as it moved North. Canada only had 1 million in service over the course of the war, but they were predominantly volunteers. Those that weren't were on Home Guard. If Canada had been vulnerable, there would have been no need for the late conscription because even those who did not see the point in fighting Germany for Britian's sake, would have fought on behalf of their own country.

    Japanese troops would have been extremely vulnerable to the knowledge and skills of Canadian troops who would have adapted to winter conditions for fighting. Most Americans would have also adapted and those from the South would have been assisted by those with Winter survival skills. As for the Japanese threat, as noted in the WWII Forum, the Japanese tactics were not geared for prevailing against an entrenched defense.

    In all the conjecture, what has been missed is the analysis of the character of the people. Despite overunning Holland, Belgium, France, Yugoslavia, et al there were resistance groups who would have been doing all they could. I don't believe for a minute that despite an armistice, that the British would not have still been assisting those who were fighting to regain the freedom and sovereignty of their countries. The War would have dragged on for longer, but eventually the sheer numbers of people, natural resources (Canada and the US's oil reserves would have been industrialized decades sooner) and manufacturing capacity, and the character of North Americans - descended from every ethnicity - would have prevailed. It would have then been a domino effect in reverse.
     
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  3. Sloniksp

    Sloniksp Ставка

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    Ah......, so your under the opinion that everything underneath stated by you would have been the likely scenerio?

    Lets see if I can disect it a little :D




    Im still baffled as to how you came up with these colorful scenerio's........ seems like the Axis win the entire war just because of Halifax. Are you implying that with out Great Britain, the Axis powers would have won? If not, what is the correlation between the unfolding of all of these events and Halifax? How did you come up with the dates and the results of battles? How did you come up with all of these countries joining the Axis? How on earth do the Japanese capture Hawaii or Anchorage?
     
  4. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    All that because of one person? Too many variables and "What Ifs". Pure fantasy.
     
  5. Tomcat

    Tomcat The One From Down Under

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    Having just made peace with Germany Britain isnt likely to go back to war for Yugoslavia and Greece.

    I disagree, as I said they wouldn't put there own country at risk.



    An attack on the Dutch East Indies and America would not in itself threaten the British Empire in the East and since we would not be at war with Germany and Italy the full weight of the worlds largest navy the Royal Navy and the RAF could be used to deter any Japanese aggression.

    You are missing an important fact here, the Germans and the Japanese are allied as the Axis forces as well as other countries, thus if Britain goes to war with Japan because of the alliance Germany would be forced to declare war on Britain because of the alliance.

    The Germans alone would be able to employ atleast 40 more divisions that where used in the occupation of Western Europe for the invasion of the USSR and the Italians could use their entire navy and air force against the USSR not to mention the dozens of divisions that engaged the British in real time.
    France would still be under the Vichy government and no threat to Germany.

    You never said that france had been conqueroerd by Germany in the original post just an armistce, however the Germans would never shift there entire western army over the eastern front, what about partisans and the threat from britain still being there.

    All is the same as in real time except Lord Halifax is Prime Minister instead of Churchill things only change after the surrender of France when Britain all so comes to terms with Germany.
    Vichy France will still be created.

    Then as I said above Britain would end up in a war wiht japan(axis) thus bringing the British to war with Germany again.

    The Axis forces would have hundreds of thousands of extra soldiers, tanks and aircraft.

    And you think that the Soviets would just roll over and give there country to the germans, as I have said before they can retreat for a long time back across there country and the germans don't have the man power to cover all the other countries plus the long supply lines to the front and the long front that would be created.


    ps. the bold is not me yelling just me showing you where my points seperate you points from mine
     
  6. British-Empire

    British-Empire Member

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    He hasnt taken the entire European continent.
     
  7. British-Empire

    British-Empire Member

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    Japan would very much be contained against the Empire with a 900 ship Royal Navy in the area.
    As for Nuclear wepons would America have them by 1945 without British based Scientists?
     
  8. Tomcat

    Tomcat The One From Down Under

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    So according to your 'timeline' which country hasnt been conqueored except Britain and Vichy counties?
     
  9. British-Empire

    British-Empire Member

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    Canada would have had the full force of the Empire behind it if she was attacked no need to side with America.
    Seems a lot of wishful thinking in the above.
     
  10. British-Empire

    British-Empire Member

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    Just likely what would have happened if Britain wasnt in the war with current plans in real time and extra troop numbers.
     
  11. British-Empire

    British-Empire Member

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    Yes only because of one person the man who could have been Prime Minister had he wanted.
    It's very realistic.
     
  12. Tomcat

    Tomcat The One From Down Under

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    you think canada would rely on Britain for her defence, that would be an absurd descision on there part, not only would Britain station troops incase of german aggressionwhether an armistce or not, just look at all the non agression pacts and lies hitler told about not invadeing countires. But they would have to commit troops into the south of asia, and the 900+ ships you talk of would never be fully commited into a 'second theatre' or war ehy would never strip Britain of her defences. Canada would rely on the closet and stongest country which would be America.

    I think your whole original thread is 'wishful thinking':confused:
     
  13. British-Empire

    British-Empire Member

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    read the above
     
  14. Tomcat

    Tomcat The One From Down Under

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    This is just absurb, your views are completely one sided you are not reviewing facts just pure speculation. This dosn't matter ' As Japan and Italy didnt back Germany when they went to war.' The fact is they were allies, the axis forces, thus making Japans enemys of the European axis's enemys (germany, Italy) meaning war with Japan meant war with Germany.

    Yes the British would feel that they were at risk of being invaded, look at these two points

    1.Germany has conquoered the whole of Europe except Britain, dosn't that make you think that you are next?
    2.Germany has lied and lied about countries they werent going to invade, but they did why would Britain be any different?

    Germany would know this two so they would never move all these hundred of thousands of troops needed in france to hold the costal defenses against the above points.

    Now something that you are missing is that for every country that Germany controls that is more and more divisions that are diverted from the frontlines to protect all these countries not only from invasion from other countries, but also to stop partisans and uprisings such as the warsaw uprising, this dosn't include the extra troops need to drive the endless amount of supply trucks needed to not only fuel the frontline divisions but al those in these support areas and the support troops needed to defend these supply lines against resistance units, so these hundreds of thousands of troops would be in every other country but russia.
     
  15. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    Dont confuse his fantasy with the reality of Manpower and Logistics LOL. The Germans were having those problems with what they had in real life. Just imagine the problems being 10 fold with the universe he is proposing.
     
  16. Tomcat

    Tomcat The One From Down Under

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    Im still trying to figure out how the japanese beat the americans and the british in this scenario, considering he said that britain would have 900 ships lol. These what if japanese sound superhuman.:D
     
  17. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    I don't know. Martians help perhaps? But I thought the Germans were the supermen? ;) :p
     
  18. Za Rodinu

    Za Rodinu Aquila non capit muscas

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    Hamlet, Act III, sc. II

    :rofl:
     
  19. Shangas

    Shangas Member

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    After reading through this thread, I have to say I don't see Britain being able to maintain the peace. Even if they did make peace with Germany or whatever - Japanese expansion in the Pacific would have caused a war anyway - Malaya (as it was called at the time) and Singapore, as well as Hong Kong, were all British crown colonies. Japanese invasions of these countries would have meant an attack on the British Empire and thus would have brought England into the war. Perhaps a little later than when it really did, but it would happen nonetheless.
     
  20. British-Empire

    British-Empire Member

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    Yes and here they are with over a million more soldiers to use and lots more transport and an arms industry unmolested by allied bombing.
     
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