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Green Beret Hero Was A WW II Nazi Decorated Hero!

Discussion in 'WWII General' started by Spaniard, Mar 17, 2010.

  1. Spaniard

    Spaniard New Member

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    Finnish borne Lauri Allan Torni fought for the Finnish Army in WWII, when his country surrendered he joined the Nazi German Army,
    and in covert operations fought the Russian Army. He led ski airborne special units behind Soviet lines on covert raids and
    ambushes. In 1945 Capt. Torni was decorated with the highest German and Finnish Awards and the rank of Captain in both armies.

    At the end of the War with the help of the Lodge Act he immigrated to the US. Now going by the name of Larry Thorne he joined
    the US Army as a Privet, his special skills were noticed and he was promoted to sergeant and made an instructor in mountain and
    arctic warfare at Ft. Carson, which later led to be selected for Special Forces (Green Berets) and promoted to Lieutenant in 1956.

    Thorne died in Nam in Oct 1965 in a helicopter crash, only to be declared dead in 1966 by the US Army. His body was found only in 1999.

    It’s to be noted The 1968 John Wayne movie "Green Berets" main character Sven Kornie, was based loosely on Maj. Thorne.

    Both links are source

    US Special Forces Legend Larry Thorne: Green Beret hero who had served under three flags

    Larry Alan Thorne, Major, United States Army
     
  2. Mehar

    Mehar Ace

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    A lot of ex-Axis veterans ended up in Vietnam, most notably the French Foreign Legion from what I recall. There wasn't much of a life left for them when the war ended since family either died or ran away, homes were destroyed, etc making the only possible route more military service.
     
  3. Fury 1991

    Fury 1991 New Member

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    More Nazis ended up in the U.S. Army than what people realize. Many served in Korea. May that great man rest in peace.
     
  4. lwd

    lwd Ace

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    Is there any indication he was ever a Nazi? Just from what I read here it seems:
    1) He fought for them or perhaps more correctly fought with them against the soviets.
    2) He was decorated by them. (so the title is not incorrect)
    But I'm not sure at all it would be correct to call or infer that he was a Nazi.
     
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  5. C.Evans

    C.Evans Expert

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    I sure wish that the term "Nazi Army" would not be used in the future. What I would like to know is-what the heck is a Nazi Army? Never heard of one existing before? Must be something I guess ill have to take time to look up on the net somewhere.
     
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  6. brndirt1

    brndirt1 Saddle Tramp

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    I agree, fighting against the invaders of your nation isn't the same as being a Nazi. The enemy of my enemy etc., the entire war made for some strange bedfellows and a Finn fighting the Soviet invaders in a German organization is believable, doesn't make him a Nazi.

    His immigrating to America and joining our armed forces is also no a stretch. That is the fast track to citizenship after all. Was then, still is to the best of my knowledge. That he was a brave man, and awarded medals by two separate and completely different types of country is also not a surprise. Brave is brave.
     
  7. Mehar

    Mehar Ace

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    Society for some reason likes to refer to the German army of the time as "Nazi's" even though we don't call the American forces "Democrats", Canadians "Conservatives", or even the German army of WW1 as "Kaisers", etc.

    Technically I guess the "Nazi Army" would be the S.S. as they were the military wing of the Nazi Party.
     
  8. Spaniard

    Spaniard New Member

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    Ok You can say "Nazi German Army" Google "Nazi Army" and you get So Many Links. I know what your Implying The Nazi Party and the German Army are defrent, thats the problem many others see them as same.

    That's how many see it.

    The Youngest Corporal In The Nazi Army - 60 Minutes - CBS News
    The Youngest Corporal In The Nazi Army - 60 Minutes - CBS News


    This Link gives you the supposed Definition Of "Nazi Army"

    Urban Dictionary: Nazi Army

    Nazi Army 22 up, 2 down[​IMG][​IMG] buy nazi army mugs, tshirts and magnets
    Nazi Army is a bad wording for the German Army in WWII. It refers to the main political ideology of the Nazis.
    Before the war, during it, after it and even today many people don't get the difference between Party and Army.
    Trivializing is quite popular at this topic. The term Nazi army consists like of two words, it's a compound of Nazi and Army. The German Army (Wehrmacht) was criminalized by the Western and particularly the Eastern Allied countries. It was declared as evil as the Fascist Leadership. Basically this makes any army as bad and evil as its leader.
    This means that f.ex. the whole US Army was bad and evil as their supreme commander Lyndon B. Johnson in the Vietnamese War. Which is obviously a lie just like the trivializing of the Nazis together with the German Soldiers is wrong.
    "1939, the evil Nazi Armies start(ed) their assault on peaceful Europe!"

    "The Nazi Army was the most evil army in the world"


    YouTube
    The Nazi Army
    YouTube - The Nazi Army

    What is the Difference between the German Army, Gestapo, Nazi Party, SA, SS, and Wehrmacht?

    What is the Difference between the German Army, Gestapo, Nazi Party, SA, SS, and Wehrmacht?


    I changed it to "Nazi German Army."
     
  9. brndirt1

    brndirt1 Saddle Tramp

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    Be that as it may "Spaniard", it is both journalistic and historical laziness to use the term "Nazi Army".

    That is unless one is speaking of the Waffen SS, or the rest of the SS branches, as they were the only branches which required Nazi membership when they were first formed. Even they became adulturated as the need for manpower outstripped available persons.
     
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  10. Kruska

    Kruska Member

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    Again a fine example for Nazi posts that are commented without going into the factual accounts.
    Only posting bla, bla in regards to WWII topics.

    He served in the Finnish army and was awarded Finnlands highest order
    So far correct - if the Mannerheim Cross was indeed Finnlands highest order?

    He received Germany's highest order the knights cross - incorrect the highest German order was the oakleaves with diamonds.
    He joined the regular German Army - incorrect since he had served in the SS Finnland unit and was promoted to Hauptsturmfuehrer in 1945 = SS and not Wehrmacht.

    Therefore he was a member of a criminal organisation - and was given a new live in the USA regardless of his political/criminal history.

    Therefore he was indeed a Nazi decorated warhero - regardless of his soldiering abillities.

    Also a Mod in this thread who doesn't seem to get the idea about Nazis and the Nazi system and their means.
    Even though I am dead sure that brndirt1 knows exactly what a criminal organisation is and what it beholds.

    There is no proof that he did not commit war crimes - which is certain by being a SS member - however so far also no trial against him. But he was 100% a member of a criminal organisation - deemed as such by the allies incl. off course the USA.

    Regards
    Kruska
     
  11. Mehar

    Mehar Ace

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    Is there proof or even accusation that he did commit war crimes?

    Lauri Törni - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    He did spend time in prison after the war for "treason" but later granted a pardon.
     
  12. Kruska

    Kruska Member

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    Yes there is - since he was a member of a criminal organisation - otherwise why should it be a criminal organization? because they were fearsome freedom fighters wearing awsome cammo smogs?

    They were all declared war criminals by the allies since they didn't see a realistic chance to interview 900,000 members.

    Geeezas - this is supposed to be a WWII forum that is supposed to be about WWII. Where does all this ignorance come from? or is it just pretended?

    Regards
    Kruska
     
  13. Mehar

    Mehar Ace

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    The members thing was largely "association fallacy" was it not? It wouldn't be the same as if a member was deemed a criminal and subject to a trial or go into hiding and attempt to escape authorities?

    No need to adopt such a harsh tone, I merely asked a question. If everyone knew everything about World War 2 there wouldn't be much need for the forum now would there? ;)
     
  14. Kruska

    Kruska Member

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    Dear Mehar,

    in the other thread I gave you a full run up of the Nazi system, its roots, causes and goals and who and what the SS was about. Obviously you don't bother to read it and check the sources for your self.

    And I am slowly getting tired of explaining to someone what a criminal organisation is and what it beholds for those who were members in it.

    That is why many of us elder rouges get out of these WWII topics since it is like talking to a wall - and sometimes - sorry Mehar - it becomes very obvious that certain posters simply don't want to understand because it obviously doesn't fit into their picture.

    Sorry for sounding rude - but everyone's patience has an end - and now it is 03:30 in China and way past bed time for me.

    But it was worth it, since one member (Totenkopf) now understands what we 'elder" rouges are talking about.

    Regards
    Kruska
     
  15. Heinrich

    Heinrich Member

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    Again denial of the most critical facts ..very true . If theres modding needed its on these things , its all perfectly described in articles about holocaust denial
    (not accepting the fact that SS is a criminal organisation is seen in the same light )..
    thats a crimininal offense in public guys .
    Being a mod requires immediate action on these things , if not sooner or later the forum itself will run into problems with some real ww2 organisations who'll wipe the floor with this crap juridically . BTW: .. its not a fine only offense !
     
  16. brndirt1

    brndirt1 Saddle Tramp

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    A point if I may, the difference being that while the Waffen SS was declared a "criminal organization" post war, there were exceptions made at the Nuremberg trials. One being all who were "conscripted" into the Waffen SS, and a few who joined after 1943 when their own military collapsed and they were battling the Soviets. This included some members from the Baltic, and the Balkan states.

    When Thorne joined the Waffen SS, it had not yet been declared a criminal organization, nor did he join it to further the Nazi ideology. He joined to combat the Soviet invaders, not to engage in the genocidal, war criminal activities of the SS organization. I doubt he was considered a "war criminal" when he immigrated to the US, but even then a great many did so by the simple expedient of lying to the board of immigration.

    I also doubt he was in the hierarchy of policy making for the organization. I'm NOT defending the Waffen SS or anyother Nazi organ, I am looking at the difference of guilt by personal action, and guilt by association however.
     
  17. Mehar

    Mehar Ace

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    I've read through the Wiki many times already, regardless it does not answer my question. This man in question is a member of the Waffen S.S., brndirt1's response was more than helpful in regards to exemptions and such.

    You haven't explained anything in regards to what it means for its members other than "members were deemed criminals too", that's not very helpful hence me asking for more information. My knowledge on the S.S. is a bit limited as the Wehrmacht is mainly what I focus on for the Axis. If what brndirt1 said is indeed true your argument has a few holes in it making things moot, instead of attacking others maybe you should listen to what he has to say?

    To my knowledge, no one is saying the S.S. isn't a criminal organization.
     
  18. LJAd

    LJAd Well-Known Member

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    Two questions:
    1)your sources are claiming that Thorne joined the SS (=the Waffen SS )after the Continuation War stopped ;my question :in what unit ?
    2)your sources are claiming that Thorne was decorated with the highests German awards ;my question :which ones ? In "Ritterkreuztraeger " he is not mentioned,maybe he recieved the Iron Cross,but this was not the highest German award
     
  19. Heinrich

    Heinrich Member

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    Suggesting a so called difference between good and bad SS is already officially denieing Mehar . Being member was enough , only the amount of punishment later was debateable and varied by member ...but as a whole they were all convicted at Nurnberg . This implicates that with the suggestion there were not so wrong SS your putting the whole nurnberg judgement in question and dont fully understand what SS really is or was ...not army ! Political volunteers...and the instrument for Adolfs lebensraum theory .
    Later the HIAG was founded wich made it possible that ex members could get a pension as people did serve for their country.But they were never given rights to openly wear their colours as triumphers ever again ..
     
  20. Kruska

    Kruska Member

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    brndirt1;476080]
    Yes of course you may,

    So what, after postwar - it was declared a criminal organization - end


    So if they received a blank cheque - they should be gratefull and understand the meaning of having served in a criminal organization - and who want's to march in a criminal organization - right, criminals or plain stupid people.




    Who cares this is not the topic at all.


    How do you know? you talked to him or its your assumtion?


    How do you know? you talked to him or its your assumtion?


    Finns were not excluded - if outside the Finnish SS - which he was later.



    This is not the topic at all



    Sorry but defending a person declared as a member of a criminal organization is just doing that, especially If one in - this case you - wouldn't know anything about his doings in the SS besides the above article.
    I also wouldn't know, but I now he was a member of a criminal organization who was responsible to keep the Nazis in power and made sure that the Holocaust happened. As long as he does not publicly justify the SS and Nazi deeds as a meere soldiering effort - let him be.

    However as a Mod in a WWII forum - please - honestly please - keep in mind that your above posting now allows Mehar to believe that not all SS members were criminal, that they meerly fought for their country and as such should be proud to have served in the most ruthless unit of at least the last 300 years and keep on marching.

    The only valid answer IMHO birndirt1, would have been - not all SS members were involved in atrocities - they should be gratefull for not having been put on trial or due to numbers never been investigated upon - to show or display a former SS membership clearly contributes by far larger to the fact that this person is a Nazi till today then actually proofing that he was innocent.

    Sorry birndirt1 - but the Neo Nazis will probably approach you very soon and make you an honorary SS member.

    Regards
    Kruska
     

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