Discussion in 'Military History' started by Totenkopf, Dec 11, 2008.
Yes, he lost his arm. Attack on Santa Cruz de Tenerife.
Nelson was Killed at Trafalgar, he lost his arm at the Battle of Santa Cruz de Tennerife.
Rats, foiled again.
Hello; Woops! I got it a little backwards!!! I should have said Admiral Villeneuve's defeat at the hands of the Royal Navy.. I read someplace that one reason (there are no doubt several) for the French navy's defeats especially at the Nile and Trafalgar was the loss of so many of their High ranking officers during the French Revolution when many were executed for being part of the nobility.
Isandlwana 1879, The British Army was humiliated by the Zulus.
I think that significance wise, the Chinese defeat in the Mongolian invasion is probably within the "Top 8" most significant military actions that forged history. But seriously, the Chinese side of things was utterly ridiculous, the unification of Mongolia was something that the Chinese were very aware of, so they really should have been more modest about their wall when Mongols rode on horseback, the Chinese had manpower, technology, economic power and experienced leaders all on their side, but non of it was used, because they insisted that their wall was so dang glorious and invincible and that the Mongols would never think to go around.
I was going to mention Isandlwana but since I was already beaten to it I will try arthur st. clair's defeat to the american indian confederation led by Little Turtle. The worst defeat of the United States army to native american forces. oops looks like I was beaten to that one also, still I will second it. Far overshadows custer's defeat at little bighorn.
Most of the embarassing defeats listed above, Islandlwana, Spion Kop, Little Big Horn, Khartoum, even Cannae etc etc are quickly put right and the War won.
So the most embarassing defeat in my view is one that also results in the loss of the War. Has therefore to be either Dien Bien Phu or even better Panjeer Valley lost by the Russians to the ragtag army of Masood and their eviction from Afghanistan. This was a major reason for the disintegration of the Soviet Empire. Especially embarassing cos the Russians fought with all the gloves off - an advantage that no Western combattant could enjoy.
Then, Midway was obviously the most humiliating defeat for Japan.
Even if Midway is reversed I don't see Japan winning.
It depends on further Japanese actions, but of course, taking into account strength of US military industry, Japan had no chances from the very beginning of the war. Still, Japanese victory at Midway could result in more American losses than it was in reality.
One more observation: after a string of incredible successes, the Japanese were confident that, even without Zuikaku and Shokaku, Kido Butai would eliminate any American carrier force opposing it. Thus, the crushing defeat with loss of all four carriers became a real shock for them and was even more humiliating, than if the American forces had an advantage or were at least equal to Japanese ones.
Its not definite though, who knows what perhaps 6 months of largely uncontested superiority could give them. Its not as if the commonwealth had any sizable fleet or even land based aircraft that could contest them. The US fleet didn't have much left to strike with an open sees battle.
What !!!! Your trying to stay on topic? Is that allowed here?
Very good point
They really didn't have the force to take Hawaii, Australia, or New Zeeland much less India. Pushing their perimeter further is going to further stress thier already over stressed log system.
I mostly prefer to avoid speaking on abstract topics connected with global strategy like possible actions of Japan in case of victory at Midway and so on. I am more attracted by technical and tactical level.
Hi; Although it's not just a single battle but a campain how about the allied disaster at Gallipoli ? There were more than 200,000 allied casualities and they never made it through the Dardanelles and from what I,ve read the only thing that went somewhat smoothly was the evacuation ...
The Battle of the Wabash, 4th November 1791, 60% of General St Clairs army wiped out by Native American Indians.