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The Battle of Ebro

Discussion in 'Prelude to War & Poland 1939' started by JeffinMNUSA, Mar 27, 2010.

  1. JeffinMNUSA

    JeffinMNUSA Member

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    Ola;
    The most famous battle of the Spanish Civil War was the Battle of Ebro in the summer of 1938. Franco had recently conquered the province of Aragon and had pushed through to the sea, cutting the Republic in half. With this offensive the Republicans hoped to reverse their deteriorating situation.
    After a promising start the Reds bogged down and Franco counterattacked; and Ebra became just another Republican debacle in a series of Republican debacles. The Axis learned much about fighting and defeating communist forces during the Spanish Civil War-and they were to replicate these feats on a monstrous scale in the USSR some three years later.
    JEffinMNUSA


    timeline; Spanish Civil War - Main Events Of The War
    Ebro;
    battle of the ebro - Google Search
    Ebro;
    Google Image Result for http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/SPinternational2.jpg
     
  2. Spaniard

    Spaniard New Member

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    On 23rd September, Juan Negrin, head of the Republican government, announced at the League of Nations in Geneva that the International Brigades would be unilaterally withdrawn from Spain. That night the 15th Brigade and the British Battalion moved back across the River Ebro and began their journey out of the country.
    The rest of the Republican Army remained and had to endure continuous attacks from the Condor Legion. General Gonzalo Queipo de Llano also brought forward 500 cannon which fired an average of 13,500 rounds a day at the Republicans. By the middle of November, the Republicans were forced to retreat.
    During the battle of Ebro the Nationalist Army had 6,500 killed and nearly 30,000 wounded. These were the worst casualties of the war but it finally destroyed the Republican Army as a fighting force.

    Ebro

    The Battle of Ebro was the principal battle of the Spanish Civil War. It took place between the 24th of July and the 18th of November 1938, in the vicinity of Gandesa. By the time the battle ended the Republicans had lost about 30,000 dead, 20,000 wounded, and 20,000 prisoners, while the Nationalists lost 33,000 killed and wounded. This defeat effectively destroyed the International Brigades and put an end to any hope of Republican victory.

    Battle of Ebro - From The Probert Encyclopaedia

    The Glasgow Herald - Aug 24, 1938

    The Glasgow Herald - Google News Archive Search
     
  3. JeffinMNUSA

    JeffinMNUSA Member

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    Ola Spaniard;
    Spanish Republican art is quite good; The Foreboding Propaganda Posters of the Spanish Civil War*|*CreativeCloud
    AND they had the best artists in the world-Hemmingway included-doing their propaganda.
    So in the public relations department they were probably the best the world has ever seen.
    Unfortunately for them their generals were abyssmal. I am about finished with the Beevor account and he details the lack of communication, the bickering and game playing, the poor communications, the lack of initiative given subordinates, the Stalinist witch hunting, the secret police terrorists, horrible logistics (yes men do need water in the summer), the dunderheaded attack orders, the stupid hold orders, the blaming, the misuse of armour (wasn't Tuhkachevsky shot in 1937?), the summary executions, the lack of coordination...on and on. In short the Republican Army was the mirror image of the military of the USSR during this time of purges.
    Such an overpoliticized entity could not have hoped to have prevailed against a better armed and professional foe. It is a wonder that they held on for as long as they did.
    Beevor also gets into how dissaffected the non communist peoples of the Republic had become after the takeover of the Army and State by Comitern. Many became indifferent to which set of thugs it would be running the country and just wanted the war to end. Beevor does not exactly say, but why did Aragon fall so easily?
    If you ever wonder where it was that Hitler got the idea that he could "kick the door in of the USSR and the whole rotten structure will come crashing down" look no further than the Spanish Civil War.
    JeffinMNUSA
     
  4. efestos

    efestos Member

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    Franco was criticized by his German advisers (and the current authors) for failure to outflank the Republicans and so end the battle quickly.

    He chose to wear a long struggle to bleed the republican army. And he did.

    Grandpa was there, the nationalist had 12 planes (ridicolous in WWII but impressive these days) over his enemies every moment.

    The Republicanist forces started that fight but their planes didn´t started operations till four days after the initial attack!

    IMHO. That Jeffin wrote about the efectiveness and politizacion of the republican army is absolutly correct.
     
  5. JeffinMNUSA

    JeffinMNUSA Member

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    Efestos;
    So just why was Franco so SLOW to exploit situations? Some speculate that it was because he was trying to drag the process on and bleed the enemy slowly, like a cat torturing a mouse. His vindictiveness and unnecessary cruelties are well documented so maybe this is so. But to prolong a war just to make the enemy suffer?
    But maybe it was something else...Do you suppose it is also possible that the man was just plain slow? Is it possible that he just did not want things to move too fast because his limited intellect could not adjust? Or perhaps he was just being obstinate and showing his German handlers who was boss? THe man definitely had a spine whatever his other defects of character. It can never be known for sure what went on in the mind of El Caudillo, but it is perplexing that he did not smash up his enemies when the opportunity presented itself.
    The Germans were to make no such mistakes when Barbarossa came-they had studied the Spanish Civil War too closely.
    If the USSR learned anything from the experience there is no evidence of it-at least in 1941.
    JEffinMNUSA
    PS. OR maybe Franco would not follow up because he saw himself as a knight of old and would allow his foe to get up before starting the battle anew? OR maybe he was a drunkard and would not start any new enterprises until the party was over?
     
  6. Spaniard

    Spaniard New Member

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    Good link, Guys check this site out has a few of the art provided on the site mentioned above and many others with an explanation of each.
    just click on the picture and the link will open, as example this is the first picture.


    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]


    This heroic image was painted in 1938 by Spanish artist Xavier Bueno. The artist titled his painting The Spanish Soldier and dedicated it to the memory of his friend, Nazario Cuartero, who died defending Madrid from fascist armies. The tragic portrait shows the anti-fascist defender suffering from a serious gun shot head wound. He gazes in puzzlement at the blood spurting from his head, staining his clothes and hand. The sadness and profundity of this remarkable painting almost takes on religious proportions, with the emotional intensity of the work heightened by the artist's use of a monochromatic palette.This moving portrait sums up the despair felt by the people of Spain and of the world, as the Spanish republic was slowly being strangled by the combined armies of Hitler, Mussolini, and Franco.
    1938 brought defeat after defeat for the forces of republican Spain, and a year later the fascist armies succeeded in totally crushing the republic. General Franco's fascist troops entered Madrid on March 27th 1939. On April the 1st, the fascist general announced the "end" of the war... full scale repression followed... there was mass flight from Madrid... and the United States recognized Franco's government. In 1945 the United Nations declared Franco's fascist Spain to be unfit for membership in the world body, but in 1953 the U.S. signed a "defense agreement" with Franco. The fascist regime continued to rule with an iron hand until Franco's death in 1975. Spain's first democratic elections since 1936 were held in 1977.



    ART FOR A CHANGE - Posters of the Spanish Civil War





    It was all about supplies rifles ammo+++ Air power decided this campaign also. I found this link at the bottom that explains it better and has allot of information. Because of the material losses from the Battle of Terual, half the Republican troops even lacked rifles and since the best troops had been withdrawn to refit, the frontline defenders had no combat experience. The Republic could not replace its lost equipment as Soviet aid was starting to dry up. Essentially the Republican army was surprised by the Nationalist attack. The Nationalists had redeployed their forces much faster than the Republican general staff thought possible. Although warned by spies, the Republican generals convinced themselves that the Nationalists were going to resume the Guadalajara offensive. Another mistake that the Republican military leadership made was that they assumed that the Nationalists were as tired and worn out as the Republicans.


    Aragon Offensive - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    [​IMG]
    Destroyed Belchite, was not rebuild and stayed as monument.
     
  7. efestos

    efestos Member

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    Well, in fact Franco told it to his staff during the battle. IMHO. The model of that man was the pre-war French army. No movement war or something like that. And sure it was an oportunity to show he germans he was the boss.

    May be he thought he was fighting a colonial-war, so it was more important to break down the enemy's morale, and the dead count than gainig territories.

    PS. Franco wasn´t a drunkard. Sure, if it was it would have been very publicited. His only known vices: Hunting, power, and a damn easy to sign death sentences.

    (Sus únicos vicios conocidos fueron : La caza, el Poder y una maldita facilidad para firmar penas de muerte.)
     
  8. Spaniard

    Spaniard New Member

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