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Turning Points - ETO

Discussion in 'What If - European Theater - Western Front & Atlan' started by LouisXIV, Oct 14, 2010.

  1. LJAd

    LJAd Well-Known Member

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    About another strategy :the Germans never could have enough OPERATIONAL UBoats to block the sealine between US and Britain,this would demand an enormous increase of UBoat production,what Germany could not afford:more UBoats would mean less tanks,aircraft....
    On 1 january 1942,of 249 Uboats,only 55 were available for the NA,and only 22 were on patrol .The losses (British,allied and neutral,convoys to Russia included) were 48 ships with 377000 GRT..
    This means that in one month,22 UBoats were sinking 48 ships .
    IMHO,the conclusion is that only by chance the UBoats could detect a convoy .
     
  2. lwd

    lwd Ace

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    One way of looking at a turning point is to say would things have changed much if the event didn't happen or happened in a considerably different way. If the end result doesn't change much is then perhaps the turning point occured earlier if it existed. Perhaps "critical point" would be a better terminology for this rather than turning point. If you are steering say a battleships the critical point is when the order to turn is given the turning point is when you actually start to turn.
     
  3. lwd

    lwd Ace

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    Some interesting data in reference to the battle of the Atlantic can be found here:
    Axis History Forum • View topic - Escort warship building effort in the United Kingdom & Empir
    The follow up to this exchange may also be of some import:
     
  4. Victor Gomez

    Victor Gomez Ace

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    Good try lwd.....don't let me hold you guys back....you are enjoying and learning....I can try to watch and learn too.
     
  5. 4th wilts

    4th wilts Member

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    I don't know if this has been discussed here,but the Norwegian campaign was a disaster IMO for the German navy.I believe they lose 2 or 3 cruisers and about 9 destroyers.The royal navy lost heavily too,but I believe the sea lion plan was somewhat scuppered by these losses.Does anyone agree?,cheers.
     
  6. 36thID

    36thID Member

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    Just my 2 cents worth...

    Hitler could never hold Britian if he invaded. They would of been defeated quickly. With America involved after a British invasion, Hitler and Germany would of been smashed. We would of rushed to her aid. I really feel America was waiting for this. Look at our Manuvers and the Federalization of National Guard units in the States.

    Hitler should of never invaded Russia. How did that work out for him ?

    My main questions about WW 2 history as it played out is:
    How stupid were these 2 battles ?

    The idiotic and wasteful Battle Of The Bulge. Hitler could of extended the defense of Germany instead of wasting tens of thousands of troops and arms on a pipedream.

    The escape of German troops through the Straits Of Messina after the defeat in Sicily. One of the Allies biggest blunders.

    Best Regards
     
    rkline56 likes this.
  7. Gromit801

    Gromit801 Member

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    IF America had gotten involved. Roosevelt let all of Europe go to Hitler, and isolationism might have dug in a little harder.
     
  8. lwd

    lwd Ace

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    The US was clearly going to get involved and no FDR didn't leat "all of Europe got to Hitler". Indeed islationism was becoming an endangered beast by the end of 41 and was clearly loosing ground by the middle of that year.
     
  9. freebird

    freebird Member

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    17% larger, but not stronger, because the shipping routes are longer.
    The demands for the PTO/CBI are much more, reducing the tonnage available for the ETO.

    No, and they don't need to, that's what I'm talking about better strategy.

    U-boat deployment is one of the things that could be done differently.

    And why do you assume that they must find a convoy?
     
  10. belasar

    belasar Court Jester Staff Member

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    Had Germany successfully invaded and occupied Britain, the Germans would have held it for a considerable time.

    The US Army could send perhaps one(1) semi-combat ready division to England in 1940, Perhaps two (2) in the summer of 1941. Not enough to save Britain or retake it from Germany. All the carriers in the fleet would be needed to provide aircover for any American counter invasion. Realisticly it would be spring 1943 before we had the resources to retake the British Isles.

    Then again Germany had less than 5% chance of pulling off an invasion anyway.
     

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