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US 34th and 36th Infantry Divisions at Cassino

Discussion in 'Italy, Sicily & Greece' started by Earthican, May 27, 2012.

  1. Earthican

    Earthican Member

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    While reading a memoir by a 36th ID veteran, I could not find Monte Castellone on the maps of the US Army official history. After searching several sections of the text, I was surprised to find it was across the Rapido and north of Monte Cassino.

    I read the whole history a few years back but for some reason this battle did not fix itself in my memory. The lack of a detail map seems to be the prime cause for my "senior moment". Given the vast number of maps usually provided in the official histories, I am inclined to think that a detail map was intended and somehow left out.

    Here's a link to the section of the history. Attached is a clip from the overall map that shows the battle area.

    HyperWar: US Army in WWII: Salerno to Cassino [Chapter 21]

    Also attached is a map where I attempted to interpret the battle from the text. I believe the source map came from the NZ official history (thank you Kiwi's). I still have not identified "Mass Manna" that the 142d Infantry (36th ID) took on 1 February 1944.
     

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    Johnesgef and Kendusimmus like this.
  2. Gebirgsjaeger

    Gebirgsjaeger Ace

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  3. Earthican

    Earthican Member

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    Awesome map!!! Danke

    I did not see "Mass Manna" (or possibly Massa Manna) on that map. It was described as "about two miles northwest of Monte Castellone and the same distance southwest of French-held Monte Belvedere."

    I assume its a group of buildings.
     
  4. Gebirgsjaeger

    Gebirgsjaeger Ace

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    Didn´t found it too!
     
  5. Gebirgsjaeger

    Gebirgsjaeger Ace

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    The italian word "Masseria" means farm so that it can be a single farmhouse and thats hard to find.
     
  6. Gebirgsjaeger

    Gebirgsjaeger Ace

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  7. Earthican

    Earthican Member

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    Great job. I was starting to doubt the written description, but that's a match.
     
  8. TD-Tommy776

    TD-Tommy776 Man of Constant Sorrow

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    That is a great map, Ulrich! My great uncle was in the 776th TD Bn which spent a bit of time and ammunition in the Cassino area. I remember seeing a reference to Castellone as well as other locations on that map. It is by far the most detailed map of the area I have seen. Thanks for posting it.

    So, E, what is the title of the book you are reading?
     
  9. Gebirgsjaeger

    Gebirgsjaeger Ace

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    You´re very welcome, Tommy! If you want to see some more regarding the places your Great Uncle was, tha PM me and i´ll see what i can find.
     
  10. TD-Tommy776

    TD-Tommy776 Man of Constant Sorrow

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    Thanks, Ulrich. I may take you up on that offer. :D
     
  11. Earthican

    Earthican Member

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    The Hunter and the Hunted by Bennett Palmer. Pretty average for a self-published memoir by I always learn something new. Here the 143d Infantry (or parts of) was issued tankers jackets and bib-overalls in the winter of 1943-44. They seemed to be aware that the 1941 pattern field jacket (Parson's Jacket) was inadequate. At the same time in Italy the Army was field testing the dark green combat uniform (jacket, pants, boots) that Bradley kept out of Northwest Europe until late fall 1944.
     
  12. 36thID

    36thID Member

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    I knew Ben Palmer through the 36th ID Association. Ben was a wonderful man. He sent me a copy of his book when it came out. I gave his book to my godson for a book report and sent the book report to Ben. He was proud of that report and told me it made his book worthwhile.
     
  13. TD-Tommy776

    TD-Tommy776 Man of Constant Sorrow

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    Thanks, E. If I can find it, I may pick up a copy. I've been reading the personal memoir type WWII books to get a sense of the individual soldier's experience of the war. They are usually not the best for understanding the X's & O's of the war, but then there are plenty of other sources for that information.
     
  14. 36thID

    36thID Member

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    Tommy, a good book for understanding the x's and o's:

    "From Texas To Rome" : A General's Journal
    General Fred Walker 36th Infantry Division

    It's an excellent book for the training of troops and the logistics of going to war.
     
  15. Gebirgsjaeger

    Gebirgsjaeger Ace

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  16. TD-Tommy776

    TD-Tommy776 Man of Constant Sorrow

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    Thanks Steve & Ulrich.

    Though, Ulrich, I think Opana P. would have preferred it if you had linked to Salerno to Cassino at Hyperwar instead of Scribd. ;)
     
  17. Earthican

    Earthican Member

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    I learned WWII from the ground up starting with Audie Murphy's To Hell and Back - in keeping with the topic of the Italian campaign. Better memoirs have come out since -- none that have his incomparable story -- but it was a good starting point for a youth.

    Amazon used to have a search function where I could find many titles but they have changed. This Aussie seems to have a knack for finding many titles.

    Amazon.com: Profile for John E. Larsen

    I had heard of The Hunter and Hunted and bought a used copy from an Amazon sponsored seller.
     
  18. Gebirgsjaeger

    Gebirgsjaeger Ace

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    Ohh dang! I hope i´ll stay alive!:D
     
  19. TD-Tommy776

    TD-Tommy776 Man of Constant Sorrow

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    Thanks for the tip, E. I'll check out Mr. Larsen's recommendations.

    I don't think you need to worry about staying alive, Ulrich. I'm pretty sure OP prefers slow torture to summary execution. :D
     
  20. Earthican

    Earthican Member

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    Found this report from the 756th Tank Battalion supporting the 34th ID crossing the Rapido. It uses many codewords for locations (Dog, Mike, Xray,..) so it really does not help pinpoint actions in the official history. It does highlight the coordination difficulties among the tanks, infantry, and engineers.

    This link will probably die before long but a search of CARL online might find it in the future.
    http://cgsc.cdmhost.com/cdm/singleitem/collection/p4013coll8/id/3393/rec/7
     

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