What if:--Nazi Germany vs. Imperial Japan

I forgot to add something important(but evident,implicitly) :Hitler declares war on Japan ,but not on the USA! and Hitler not being a racistne should remember that "race" was the fundament of his policy("arian" you know)

 

I think that was pretty much assumed

 

Dont forget hitler had a treaty of sorts with russia too before he attacked them.

Good question though,maybe the usa would have refused germanys advances.

Also about hitler arian ideals that may have led him to war with japan,the arians origionaly swept down into india and then swept west,i doubt hitler ever thought too much about india but maybe he would have swept to his indian brothers defence against japan.

 

Germany would have destroyed japan,not even close.

Half ways between stalingrad and burma is Tajikistan and about ten other stans,
Not tank country and not jungle either.

 

that seems to be a bit of an exaggeration. For one thing Japan is an island a lot further from Germany than even Britain was and they have a stronger navy.

Indeed if on say 1 Dec 1941 Japan had declared war on Germany the results for Germany would be a lot worse than Germany declaring war on Japan anytime between 1940 and 1945.

 

Well it is probably one of the biggest whatifs out there.

What i had in mind was a massive meeting engagement in neutral territory.
Anything beyond that would require weeks to figure out.

Germans in the jungle.
Deutsches Afrikakorps would be changed to Deutsches Junglekorps

 

The only "massive meeting engagement in neutral territory" that's even remotely reasonable is the IJN meeting the KM. Doesn't matter much where the KM is in serious trouble.

 

Well if japan and germany did go against each other in wwii then german uboats would play havoc on the japanese,
so a primary german objective would be to capture bases for the uboats.
Japan would be expected to win any jungle encounter and china might be extending things a bit too far but we can put that down as contested.
We can give africa to the germans.

But at the same time how could japan hope to even scratch germany.

 

Very few U-boats could even come close to areas where they would threaten Japanese interests. The U-boats were not particularly suited for operations in the Pacific either.

Where? If they are not logistically connected to Germany through land routes they would be subject to isolation and reduction.

I think others would dispute that.

 

Madagascar is the first place that springs to mind,its vichy so the germans should be able to lean on them and get its use
Japan was definately interested in madagascar.
Battle of Madagascar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The arguement has to be facilitated so i'm with an all conquering germany and an all conquering japan,german won russia and africa,japan won china and the "jungle"countries.
So i guess the big engagements take place in china,kazakhstan and mongolia.

 

I'm pretty sure this takes it well outside the rules for this board.

 

It'd take too long to figure everything out

 

The Germans did not have experience with fighting in the jungles.
The Japanese did not have (much) experience fighting in flat countrysides, fields, towns etc.

If the germans had completed the V2 or another atomic bomb, and used it against Japan ( like the USA did ). I think germany would have won. Also without A-boms, with much Bombing from the planes to weaken the Japanese defensive lines, and German Ships and U-boats surrounding the islands, and then landing many troops on the island to capture it.

 

I think the Germans would pick up jungle fighting very quickly. Look how fast they picked up fighting in the desert. And the Japanese in China fought in all sorts of countrysides. They wouldn't be at a disadvantage just because it wasn't jungle. Japan doesn't have any jungles, so they learned jungle fighting on the fly the way the Germans learned desert fighting.

What would hamper the Japanese would be their lack of armor and the doctrine on how to use it. Zhukov schooled them harshly at Nomonhan and they never seemed to learn the lesson. Six years after that, they still lacked decent armor. At the same time Germany would have no answer to the IJN.

What would be interesting in this scenario would be to see how the Germans reacted to an enemy even more fanatical about dying for their cause than they were. I'm thinking it would be even worse than the Eastern Front for both sides.

 

The thing I don't understand is how are these two countries half-way around the world from one another supposed to fight. Germany had no claims in the Pacific and Japan likewise. Were they just to sail their Navies to meet each other in which case the Germans would not be in good shape, especially because of thei lack of carriers.

 

Well it is alternate history, so somehow they have to fight.

 

Right but it should at least have some basis in fact or else it is just nonsense and quite difficult to discuss

 

Quite right.

 

Of course, what's lacking is any basis in fact; I think you just hit the nail on the head for this particular thread.

 

How about an extremely hypothetical scenario where (due to alien abductions/brain worm outbreak/mass hysteria or whatever) war hasn't broken out by 1940, the other major powers have retreated into extreme isolationism and the British Empire has fallen apart in such a way that the whole arabian peninsula is up for grabs, leading our two favourite aggressor nations to each send an expeditionary force to nab a private oil supply for their empire ? Maybe we could posit a six-month build-up, with the Staubigheer Arabia at Jeddah and the Far Far Far Western Expeditionary Army at Muscat?

Who would triumph in the sand-pit deathmatch on the end of the worlds most ridiculously extended supply lines?