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Worst Weapon?

Discussion in 'Weapons & Technology in WWII' started by skunk works, Nov 20, 2005.

  1. T. A. Gardner

    T. A. Gardner Genuine Chief

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    Ok, on tank busting with an L-4:

    At Arracourt Major Charles Carpenter flying an L-4 named Rosey the Rocketeer with 6 bazookas (3 under each wing) rigged to fire individually on in salvo, attacked a Panther on 19 September at about 2:00pm. His first pass missed with 2 shots. Coming in a second time at a steeper approach Carpenter hit this Panther with one of two shots causing the crew to bail out. Carpenter then made a third pass on this tank knocking it out completely.
    This was one of five tanks that Major Carpenter would eventually knock out using similar tactics by the end of the war. Also, he was not the sole participant in this sort of big game hunting. A number of other observation aircraft pilots did similar lash ups on their aircraft although none matched Carpenter's score.

    References:
    From the Beach to Barvaria 4th Armored Division Association, Munich 1946

    Patton's Vanguard Don M. Fox, McFarland & Co. 2003

    Patton's Best Nathan Frankel, E P Dutton Pub., 1978

    L Birds: Army Liasion Aircraft of World War 2 (Includes photos of several L-4 / 5's armed with bazookas. Carpenter's aircraft is no shown.)
     
  2. skunk works

    skunk works Ace

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    On a similar note (perhaps)
    Belton Cooper says in his book a quick thinking Sherman Commander (when his unit was being ravaged by 5 King Tigers) saw regular AP was having no effect, switched to WP.
    Hitting the first Tiger the crew thought they were on fire and bailed out. He tryed it again on a second Tiger and it worked again.
    His tank was then knocked out by the rest. He probably was killed, but Mr. Cooper didn't know for sure.
    There was one Brave, Smart Soldier/crew who gave their lives to save others.
    Making the best out of a very bad situation.
     
  3. Za Rodinu

    Za Rodinu Aquila non capit muscas

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    Holy cow, T.A. :D

    I suppose there had to be somebody shhoting at the Cub. Now that's what I call balls! Here's a US flag for you ;)
     
  4. Fortune

    Fortune Member

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    lol
     
  5. T. A. Gardner

    T. A. Gardner Genuine Chief

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    You might also get a laugh from the actions of P-47 fighter pilots at Arracourt on 24 September where they attacked German tanks from an altitude of about 15 to 20 feet using 500lb bombs "skipping" them into the sides of the tank. At least a couple of accounts from the German side of this state that their tank lost its radio antenna as the P-47 streaked over the vehicle!
     
  6. Za Rodinu

    Za Rodinu Aquila non capit muscas

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    FWIW only!

    I remember an article in Air Classics or so telling the story of the P-47 making a LOW level straffing at a Luftwaffe airfield in late 44 or 45, where he got so low he actually hit the ground. The P-47 skipped like a flat stone thrown at the lake and managed to remain airborne, although with a terribly deformed prop (vibration? what's that), finally getting back to base.

    I sure can't locate the source, but at the time I believed the story.

    How's that for academical proof? :D
     
  7. Martin Bull

    Martin Bull Acting Wg. Cdr

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    I think you're right about the P-47, za, but I can't think which one just now....

    But in Freeman's book 'The Mighty Eighth' ( p 152 ) there's a pic of a 359th FG P-51B, piloted by George Doersch, which did just what you described when strafing an airfield near Rheims. He managed to get back over the Channel to land at Manston with shortened, banana-shaped prop blades.... :eek:
     
  8. Fortune

    Fortune Member

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    crazy stuff...
     
  9. The Blue Max

    The Blue Max Member

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  10. redcoat

    redcoat Ace

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    The PIAT was in its element at Arnham.
    A heavily built up area, with lots of cover.
    The short range of the PIAT wasn't a problem here, and the paras were able to take great advantage of the lack of back-blast, to fire out of the buildings at the passing tanks.
     
  11. TA152

    TA152 Ace

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    I just thought of anouther British loser, the Manchester Bomber with the Rolls Royce Vulture engines installed. It has been guessed that more were lost due to engine failure than to operations. I read that they did not use much or any nickle in the engine bearings to save money and this caused overheating and fires.

    Anouther British cost cutting idea was to insist that all Bombers have wing spans under 100 feet so they would not have to build new hanger doors for the planes. The Short Sterling had 99 foot wings and a very low operational ceiling and was easy meat for the German gunners. They later changed this after many crews paid for this with their blood.

    Seems like every time the British RAF want to save money, they end up paying through the nose. Think of the F-111, and the Rolls Royce powered F-4. [​IMG] [​IMG] If they had stayed with the TSR they would have had a world beater.

    Sorry to all the British members, the USA is world leader in waste, so don't feel bad. :rolleyes:
     
  12. Martin Bull

    Martin Bull Acting Wg. Cdr

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    Yes, the manchester was an abject failure ( although it was to lead to the Lancaster ).

    The Rolls-Royce Vulture engine simply couldn't cope with the weight of the aircraft and, most fatally of all, the Manchaster was virtually impossible to fly on one engine. The Vulture was an 'X24' - best viewed as two V12 engines superimposed - and the crankshaft journals couldn't cope with the stresses. Many very brave men - including Guy Gibson - struggled with the aircraft and many died in the process.

    I've always thought that the Manchester's technical problems were similar to the later He177.As an interesting footnote, no plans or drawings of the Vulture have survived and there is no surviving engine in good condition anywhere.

    There's a lot to be said in time of war for KISS - keep it simple, stupid ! ;)
     
  13. TA152

    TA152 Ace

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  14. Martin Bull

    Martin Bull Acting Wg. Cdr

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    Yes, that's right - the Peregrine. Just goes to show that not even Rolls-Royce got it right all the time. There was a lot of mud-slinging over the Manchester, with Avro blaming RR and RR people blaming Avro's design....

    Then along came the Merlin and all was forgiven ;)
     
  15. KilroytheSniper

    KilroytheSniper Member

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    How bout the Nambu? It would go off when you pressed the sear.
     
  16. Martin Bull

    Martin Bull Acting Wg. Cdr

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    I believe you're right - the 'Nambu' was much sought-after as a souvenir due to it's distinctive styling but us a weapon it was reportedly dire.

    BTW : welcome aboard the Forums ! [​IMG]
     
  17. KilroytheSniper

    KilroytheSniper Member

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    I also heard Japanese officers had to pay for their handguns, even the Nambus that would go off on them. Thanks for the welcome. This looks like a great forum.
     
  18. Martin Bull

    Martin Bull Acting Wg. Cdr

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    Actually, I've just remembered that the Japanese had an even worse handgun, the Type 11( 94 ), designed in 1934. Unlike the Nambu, this one didn't even look good !

    I can do no better than quote John Weeks ( 'Infantry Weapons', Pan/Ballantine 1971 ) : '...the Type 11 (94) was quite simply bad....The trigger mechanism can be made to fire before the bolt has closed onto the breech.....the trigger sear can be operated either by dropping on the ground, or simply by careless handling....why it was ever accepted for the Japanese military is a complete mystery.'

    Ian V Hogg in his 'Encyclopaedia of Infantry Weapons of WWII' ( A&AP, 1977 ) is even more scathing :

    '( The Type 94 ) is an astonishing weapon..can be fired by simply grasping it carelessly..this monstrosity... is, in my estimation, a prominent contender for the title of worst military pistol ever issued'.

    Not a lot you can add, really, except.... :eek: :eek: :eek:
     
  19. Jaeger

    Jaeger Ace

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    A bit late for this one, but during the fights in the 1940 campaign in Norway, 196 inf div got tanks in support for the battles north of Lillehammer. (18 tanks, most light) They got shot up by the Boys at rifle. The germans were most impressed with this weapon as AT weapons were hard to move about the battlefield. In a truck bound for Oslo two great prizes were sent to Gen Falkenhorst. Colonel Germain (not sure witch regiment he was from.) and a Boys at rifle.
     
  20. KilroytheSniper

    KilroytheSniper Member

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    The Japanese probably didnt have any other weapons to use is why they chose that. I saw on the History Channel that Japanese officers would buy European sidearms over their own.
     
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