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GERMAN-ITALIAN RELATIONS


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#1 JCFalkenbergIII

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Posted 17 February 2008 - 01:34 AM

Its funny if the Germans did actually published and said this. LOL


GERMAN-ITALIAN RELATIONS

Is there a spoke or two broken in the Axis?

There have been many reports for a long time that German and Italian soldiers do not get along well together. The Italians are said to hate the Germans, and the Germans, in turn, make sly remarks about the fighting abilities of the Italians. Some of these reports have come from official sources. The following extract from a German publication captured in Libya seems to bear out these reports:

"ITALIAN WAR COMMUNIQUE"

"On the Tobruk front a large force of Italians attacked an enemy cyclist, causing him to dismount. After heavy and prolonged fighting they were able to puncture his tires. The front wheel was destroyed, and the loss of the rear wheel must also be considered possible. The handlebars are in our hands, but possession of the frame is still being bitterly contested."

"H. Q. Royal Italian Army"

The Japanese are said to make similar jokes about their Siamese (Thailand) allies.


http://www.lonesentry.com/articles/misc_oct42/index.html
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For the first time I have seen "History" at close quarters,and I know that its actual process is very different from what is presented to Posterity. - WWI General Max Hoffman.

#2 Tomcat

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Posted 17 February 2008 - 03:25 AM

Well as they say the italians are lovers not fighters:D
For want of a nail the shoe was lost, for the want of a shoe the horse was lost, for the want of a horse the rider was lost, for the want of a rider the battle was lost, For want of a battle the kingdom was lost, and all for the want of a horseshoe nail.

Robert,


#3 Hawkerace

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Posted 17 February 2008 - 05:44 AM

Mussoo always loved a good fight..


that he couldn't win!
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#4 redcoat

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Posted 17 February 2008 - 10:22 PM

In the North African Campaign, not only was there in-fighting between the two Axis partners, but at a senior level in the German leadership.
Rommel and the senior Luftwaffe commander on his front weren't even on speaking terms ( one time Rommel said something to the Luftwaffe officer which so offended him that he demanded a court marshall in order to clear his name, it was only because Kesselring manage to calm them down that this didn't happen)
if in doubt....Panic!!!!

#5 B-17engineer

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Posted 18 February 2008 - 02:25 PM

I didn't really know that........
"I was born in '49, A cold war kid in McCarthy time
Stop 'em at the 38th Parallel,Blast those yellow reds to hell, And cold war kids were hard to kill
Under their desk in an air raid drill,Haven't they heard we won the war, What do they keep on fighting for?"

#6 Kai-Petri

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Posted 18 February 2008 - 03:13 PM

In the North African Campaign, not only was there in-fighting between the two Axis partners, but at a senior level in the German leadership.
Rommel and the senior Luftwaffe commander on his front weren't even on speaking terms ( one time Rommel said something to the Luftwaffe officer which so offended him that he demanded a court marshall in order to clear his name, it was only because Kesselring manage to calm them down that this didn't happen)


Don´t think the Allied were that much better, really....
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#7 JCFalkenbergIII

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Posted 18 February 2008 - 07:32 PM

This from Field Marshall Kesselring about the Italian military.

" We have already noted the weak officer-enlisted relationship
which existed during World War I. That tradition continued into
World War II and was observed with concern by Kesselring. He
said,The ordinary soldier received--even in the
field--entirely different rations from those issued to
non-commissioned officers and officers. The size of
the ration was multiplied according to rank, and larger
amounts obviously also meant a better choice of good
food. The officers ate according to their ranks,
increasingly well and copiously. The ordinary soldier
was issued the most frugal ration; had it been
plentiful and good, the officer would obviously not
have needed the double, or still higher, ration
quantity. The officers, etc. ate separately by
themselves, without contact with their men, often not
knowing what and how much they received. Thus, the
war-time comradeship, the main feature of which is the
community of life and death, was being undermined...I
have often pointed out to Cavallero, what a dangerous
effect the above-mentioned conditions had on the morale
of the men...I have personally experienced that our
German field kitchens were being practically besieged
by Italian soldiers, while I was eating excellently on
the customary officers ration in the Italian officers
mess".
But Kesselring continued his unbiased appraisal with:
I do not intend to expose deficiencies by making
the above statements, but only want to clarify the
reasons for the failure of the Italian soldier in order
to give interested persons the possibility for taking
corrective actions. I also do not want to deny in any
way that the relationship ketween officers and men was
nevertheless a good one".12
Kesselring did not hesitate to applaude the "fundamental
decency of the simple Italian man and of the possibility of
progressively developing him into a good tough fighter and
soldier". His appraisals of the Italian soldier's abilities must
be considered very valid because he saw them first hand. He
said,
I have seen much too many heroic performances of
Italian units and individuals--such as the Folgore
Division near El Alamein, the artillery in the Tunisian
battles, the crews of the Kleinstkampfmittel (smallest
means of combat such as one man torpedoes) of the Navy,
the crews of torpedo boats, the units of torpedo
bombers, etc.--not to express this opinion with
conviction. But the decision [outcome] in a war is not
brought about by top performances of individuals but by
the training condition and morale of the entire
army. It is therefore wrong to represent the Italian
soldiers and the Italian people all together as
militarily inferior and unsuitable for a tough war.. In
this context, Mussoloni and his former state
secretaries are either guilty of gross neglect, or
Mussolini is definitely guilty of not having desisted
from war if he was aware of these precarious gaps.
13"

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/report/1988/HEG.htm
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For the first time I have seen "History" at close quarters,and I know that its actual process is very different from what is presented to Posterity. - WWI General Max Hoffman.

#8 redcoat

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 01:33 PM

Don´t think the Allied were that much better, really....

Depends.
Relations between the Western Allies and the Soviet Union were poor, but once you get past the senior allied generals bitching about who deserved the glory, the relationship between Britain, the Commonwealth nations, and the USA was the most effective and efficient large scale military alliance ever seen in warfare.
if in doubt....Panic!!!!




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