Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

The atomic bombing, city of Hiroshima, and aftermath in photographs


  • Please log in to reply
37 replies to this topic

#1 PzJgr

PzJgr

    Drill Instructor

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,059 posts
  • LocationJefferson, OH

User's Awards

2   

Posted 20 August 2009 - 01:01 PM

Some really nice photos I have not seen.

Hiroshima, 64 years ago - The Big Picture - Boston.com
  • mikebatzel likes this
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

#2 James Cox

James Cox

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 160 posts

Posted 20 August 2009 - 02:50 PM

Great Photos,

I wonder why many of the trees appear to have minor damage when buildings and vehicles near them were completely destroyed?
“The object of war is not to die for your country but to make the other bastard die for his.” Patton

#3 mikebatzel

mikebatzel

    Dreadnaught

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,182 posts

Posted 20 August 2009 - 02:52 PM

Good find Ike.
Please give the Combined Fleet the chance to bloom as flowers of death. This is the navy’s earnest request. RADM Tasuku Nakazawa prior to the Battle of Leyte Gulf
It is the function of the Navy to carry the war to the enemy so that it will not be fought on U.S. soil. Admiral Chester W. Nimitz

#4 rebel1222

rebel1222

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 102 posts

Posted 20 August 2009 - 05:00 PM

Very nice indeed.

#5 Gromit801

Gromit801

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,090 posts

Posted 20 August 2009 - 06:30 PM

I was reading some of the comments on that link. Good grief what is being taught these days?
"I love deadlines. I love the 'Whooshing' noise they make when they go by." - Doug Adams

#6 AndyPants

AndyPants

    Ace

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,518 posts

Posted 20 August 2009 - 07:11 PM

those were great pics......but ya some of the comments were crazzzy :eek:
  • syscom3 likes this
All the Best,

Andy

"people who are not themselves are nobody" - General George S. Patton


#7 mikebatzel

mikebatzel

    Dreadnaught

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,182 posts

Posted 20 August 2009 - 07:34 PM

I was reading some of the comments on that link. Good grief what is being taught these days?

I thought the same thing. All our children are taught is that they were dropped and the plane that dropped them. It is all buttered up. I specificly remember that I got into an argument with one of my high school history teachers (who had gone to school to teach Math by the way) who told us that the Enola Gay had dropped both bombs and that both the Pilot and Co-pilot had commited suicide over the atrocious acts they commited. It wasn't a good argument, though I won:D
Please give the Combined Fleet the chance to bloom as flowers of death. This is the navy’s earnest request. RADM Tasuku Nakazawa prior to the Battle of Leyte Gulf
It is the function of the Navy to carry the war to the enemy so that it will not be fought on U.S. soil. Admiral Chester W. Nimitz

#8 LRusso216

LRusso216

    Graybeard

  • ModeratorsOKF Moderator
  • 9,986 posts
  • LocationPennsylvania

Posted 20 August 2009 - 08:35 PM

Amazing photos, Ike. The destructive power of this one weapon was incredible. I remember see photos similar to these back in the 50's when I was in elementary school. I believe they were in Life magazine. It's hard to imagine what it must have been like.

image001.png

Lou


#9 syscom3

syscom3

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,240 posts

Posted 21 August 2009 - 12:29 AM

those were great pics......but ya some of the comments were crazzzy :eek:


I was disturbed by some of the comments too.

You would think that it was the US who started the war and only wanted to kill civilians.

But as I have learned in my political science classes, you cannot debate people who think like that. They just dont process facts, and are like finger puppets as they spew the same old propoganda.

#10 Chesehead121

Chesehead121

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 129 posts

Posted 24 July 2010 - 07:44 PM

Sorta weird when you compare the size of the bomb to the size of the area it obliterated. A 10'x2' bomb killed 80,000 people. By the way, does Nagasaki or Hiroshima still have any radiation left in it? Or has it fully recovered?
To the German Commander-- Nuts.

-- The American Commander

#11 lwd

lwd

    Ace

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,101 posts
  • LocationMichigan

Posted 27 July 2010 - 05:04 PM

I suspect that it's still a bit above the prewar background. On the otherhand it's probably lower than some other areas which suffered minimal exposure to atomic weapons. Mountain tops for instance.

This article: Question #12
implies it's at back ground but doesn't note that back ground radiation varies tremendously from place to place.

#12 syscom3

syscom3

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,240 posts

Posted 27 July 2010 - 05:07 PM

Sorta weird when you compare the size of the bomb to the size of the area it obliterated. A 10'x2' bomb killed 80,000 people. By the way, does Nagasaki or Hiroshima still have any radiation left in it? Or has it fully recovered?


Both cities recovered fairly quickly. Days in fact.

Most of the contaminating radiation was in the form of short lived radionuclides. And we're 65 years removed from the events, which is many many many half lives for those particles.

Edited by syscom3, 27 July 2010 - 08:02 PM.


#13 ULITHI

ULITHI

    Ace

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,750 posts
  • LocationAlbuquerque, New Mexico

Posted 27 July 2010 - 05:19 PM

Both cities recovered fairly quickly. Days in fact.

Most of the contaminating radiation was in the form of short lived radionuclides. And were 65 years removed from the events, which is many many many half lives fro those particles.


Thats interesting. My friend that worked for the Atomic Museum told me that people are not allowed to take the "trinitite" glass from the Trinity test site here in NM. For one, because they want to preserve it, and two, because it still gives a small dose of radiation. They sell 'fake" trinitite in the gift shop, but its made in a different way.

I know they built up all around their ground zeros, but would the ground beneath it all still have particles you woundn't want to have around you for very long?
Have a good one,
Darren

#14 brndirt1

brndirt1

    Saddle Tramp

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,709 posts

Posted 27 July 2010 - 06:35 PM

Thats interesting. My friend that worked for the Atomic Museum told me that people are not allowed to take the "trinitite" glass from the Trinity test site here in NM. For one, because they want to preserve it, and two, because it still gives a small dose of radiation. They sell 'fake" trinitite in the gift shop, but its made in a different way.

I know they built up all around their ground zeros, but would the ground beneath it all still have particles you woundn't want to have around you for very long?


Something else to keep in mind is the distance from the ground the explosions took place. The one in New Mexico was only about a hundred feet above the desert floor, those in Japan were closer to 2,000 feet above the surface.

This might very well have impacted the "amount" of radiation trapped in the "trinitite" glass from the Trinity site. I believe I read that this was one of the reasons the scientists changed the height of the detonation to the distance that they used. They believed it was possible that the radiation detected at Trinity would not be able to make it to the ground if detonated at that altitude. It was suspected that the "fireball" itself might very well consume the radiaiton before it got to the ground.

Of course what anyone knew for certain about radiation from non-natural occurring isotopes was limited at best.
Happy Trails,
Clint.

#15 ULITHI

ULITHI

    Ace

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,750 posts
  • LocationAlbuquerque, New Mexico

Posted 27 July 2010 - 07:00 PM

Something else to keep in mind is the distance from the ground the explosions took place. The one in New Mexico was only about a hundred feet above the desert floor, those in Japan were closer to 2,000 feet above the surface.

This might very well have impacted the "amount" of radiation trapped in the "trinitite" glass from the Trinity site. I believe I read that this was one of the reasons the scientists changed the height of the detonation to the distance that they used. They believed it was possible that the radiation detected at Trinity would not be able to make it to the ground if detonated at that altitude. It was suspected that the "fireball" itself might very well consume the radiaiton before it got to the ground.

Of course what anyone knew for certain about radiation from non-natural occurring isotopes was limited at best.


Ok, that would seem to make sense. I think I remember that the height they did detonate the bombs over Hiroshima and Nagasaki was calculated to make the shock wave come in to have maximum blast affect. They perfected this technique at the Nevada test site over the years.
The physics are incredible, not only for detonating the bomb itself, but also in regards to how to get as much destruction out of it as possible!
Have a good one,
Darren

#16 lwd

lwd

    Ace

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,101 posts
  • LocationMichigan

Posted 27 July 2010 - 07:33 PM

If you look at the picture here" http://en.wikipedia....y_(nuclear_test)
of the trinity test it's pretty clearly a ground burst (if the label is correct). Hiroshima and Nagasaki were both air burst. I.e. the fireball didn't touch the ground. Air burst tend to produce much less fallout and residual radiation. The fallout that is produced by an airburst also tends to have much shorter half life on average as well.

#17 brndirt1

brndirt1

    Saddle Tramp

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,709 posts

Posted 27 July 2010 - 08:01 PM

The burst at Trinity was on a tower about 100 feet up, not really a "ground" burst, but not a real "air" burst either. Origianlly they were going to put the dang thing in a steel container called Goliath, this was in case it didn't go off, but fizzled out. That way they could recover the plutonium that wasn't ruined.

Good thing that wasn't tried, can you imagin the shrapnel problem that might have created?

Here is a good link to the test.

Goto:

http://nuclearweapon...ts/Trinity.html

Edited by brndirt1, 27 July 2010 - 08:08 PM.
forgot the link!

Happy Trails,
Clint.

#18 lwd

lwd

    Ace

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,101 posts
  • LocationMichigan

Posted 27 July 2010 - 08:38 PM

My understanding is that it's considered a ground burst if the fireball touches the surface. If it's completely above the surface it's an air burst and if the top of it doesn't touch the surface it's a underground burst.

Checked it to make sure:
The Effects of Nuclear Weapons, 1977: Descriptions of Nuclear Explosions

CHARACTERISTICS OF A SURFACE BURST

2.18 Since many of the phenomena and effects of a nuclear explosion occurring on or near the earth's surface are similar to those associated with an air burst, it is convenient before proceeding further to refer to some of the special characteristics of a surface burst. In such a burst, the fireball in its rapid initial growth, abuts (or touches) the surface of the earth ...


According to http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Tsar_Bomba
The Nagasaki bomb had a fireball ~100m in diameter. I'd assume the trinity bomb was pretty close so if detonated at 100 ft it would indeed be a ground burst as the films seem to indicate.

Edited by lwd, 27 July 2010 - 08:43 PM.
additional data

  • brndirt1 likes this

#19 brndirt1

brndirt1

    Saddle Tramp

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,709 posts

Posted 27 July 2010 - 09:25 PM

Point taken "lwd", I was only making a statement that the shortness of the tower which suspended the "gadget" was close to the earth, not sitting on it exactly. But, I see your point and acknowledge its correctness.
Happy Trails,
Clint.

#20 Cpt.Ben

Cpt.Ben

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 9 posts

Posted 19 September 2010 - 02:02 PM

I know what the Japanese did were bad, but in my mind NO country should ever deserves this, but great thread :)

Edited by syscom3, 19 September 2010 - 03:30 PM.
spelling

[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]CANADA

#21 syscom3

syscom3

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,240 posts

Posted 19 September 2010 - 03:31 PM

I know what the Japanese did were bad, but in my mind NO country should ever deserves this, but great thread :)


And what were the US supposed to do to end the war?

#22 Takao

Takao

    Ace

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,016 posts

Posted 19 September 2010 - 11:09 PM

Cpt.Ben,
Yeah, your right, instead of dropping the bomb, whe should have just let the Japanese burn or starve. Since, the Army Air Force was turning every Japanese population center into ashes. Burning out Japanese industry , killing many thousands, and making many millions of Japanese homeless. The United States Navy had, by mid to late 1944, cut off the Home Islands of Japan from the rest of their controlled territories. As a result Japan was receiving very little in the way of natural resources and food supplies with which she needed to continue the war. Without the necessary foodstuffs being brought in from Japan's occupied territories, her population was slowly starving to death. However, the effects of the naval blockade were only beginning to be felt by the Japanese population in 1945, had the war continued into 1946 or 1947, the effects would have been truly horrific. Then, let us not forget the planned invasion of Japan and how costly that would have been.
  • mikebatzel and CPL Punishment like this

#23 R Leonard

R Leonard

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 475 posts

Posted 20 September 2010 - 02:04 AM

They did not deserve it, of course they did not deserve it.

They earned it.

And those who think the Americans are so so evil for employing the atomic bombs as a means to force the Japanese to surrender should bear in mind what a US Army Quartermaster Corps officer once told me: "We knew we could supply troops ashore with whatever they needed for as long as it took; what we did not know was what we were going to do with 30 million dead Japanese." So, which is worse? Shoot them, burn them, starve them, or see if the bombs bring them to their senses. And remember, who dies first when a population starves to death . . . look across the Yellow Sea, it sure is not the army.
  • mikebatzel and Chesehead121 like this
I wonder what this button does . . .

#24 macrusk

macrusk

    Proud Daughter of a Canadian WWII Veteran

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,712 posts

Posted 21 September 2010 - 02:13 AM

Gentlemen, please be cognizant that Capt Ben is a younger newer member who is learning about WWII and is of one of the generations since WWII who was taught the atomic bomb is the greatest evil to use against another nation.

Most of our teachers do not take the time to put the bombing of Japan into the context of its time - and if Ben chooses to research further on the Forum and in other resources he will no doubt have the opportunity to educate himself as to the reasons that lead to its use in 1945 and how it also lead reasonable nations to everything in their power to ensure it wasn't used again.
  • LRusso216 likes this
Regards, Michelle

Oliver Goldsmith, "I love everything that's old: old friends, old times, old manners, old books, old wines." :flag_canada_ww2: :flag_canada: :flag_uk:
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

#25 R Leonard

R Leonard

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 475 posts

Posted 21 September 2010 - 02:26 AM

Duly noted.

Cpt Ben, may I suggest you go to the library and check out a book entitled Downfall - The End of the Imperial Japanese Empire by Richard B Frank. If they don't have it, tell them you want it on inter-loan.

Not seeking to change your mind, you are certainly entitled to your opinion. You should first be aware, however, of the facts without the coloring of the intervening years.

Regards,

Rich
  • macrusk, syscom3 and LRusso216 like this
I wonder what this button does . . .




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users