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Where have I heard of the Leonidas Squadron before?


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#1 C.Evans

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Posted 27 February 2003 - 10:45 PM

They were based at Juterbog and were commanded by Oberstleutnant Heiner Lange.

I just cannot recall what ive heard on them or where? Any hilfe would be appreciated. :D
Lost are only those, who abandon themselves) Hans-Ulrich Rudel.
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#2 TA152

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Posted 27 February 2003 - 11:07 PM

There was a pilot by the name of Leonidas Maximciuc who was an anti-Stallinist Russian who flew Me-109E's for the Germans and claimed 52 victories http://history1900s....nida's squadron
That is all I could find. Hope it helps.
I need a bailout of only $500,000

#3 C.Evans

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Posted 27 February 2003 - 11:16 PM

Thanks TA for the link--ill have to get the library to unblock it from the computers so I can see it. This is thanks to their new firewall filter program. :(
Lost are only those, who abandon themselves) Hans-Ulrich Rudel.
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#4 Panzerknacker

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Posted 28 February 2003 - 10:53 AM

Are you thinking of the mighty Greek soldier Leonidas?
"GARRY OWEN"-Traditional war-cry of the US 7th Cavalry.
"CURRAHEE"-War-cry of the US 506th PIR.
"Everybody thinks that they are going to get the chance to punch some Nazi in the face at Normandy-and those days are over, they are long gone"-Lt Chris Burnett

#5 C.Evans

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Posted 02 March 2003 - 09:47 PM

Hi Ryan--nope--I was thinking of the famed Luftwaffe Squadron. :D
Lost are only those, who abandon themselves) Hans-Ulrich Rudel.
:snoopy: :ww1ace:
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#6 Fred Wilson

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Posted 03 October 2012 - 04:24 PM

The Luftwaffe "Leonidas" Bomber Wing KG 200 was the Axis "Special Ops" squadron during (and leading up to) WW2.
- One of the neatest stories of the era.

See: Luftwaffe Bomber Wing KG 200

KG 200 (lots of white space... keep scrolling for more stories

Axis History Forum • View topic - Leonidas Squadron?)

http://www.historyne...orld-war-ii.htm

Photos: http://www.ww2incolo...y-the-Luftwaffe

Edited by Fred Wilson, 03 October 2012 - 04:55 PM.
Underscore

Stepson of Arthur Ellison Sovereign:
RCAF Navigator: Lancasters and Wellingtons,
Bomber Command, WW2
http://www.members.s...ereign/Art.html

Named after Fred Sutherland of the Dambusters.

 

"Apple Pie without cheese is like a kiss without a squeeze."

A little quip from the nicest person I have ever known: My Dad.


#7 Fred Wilson

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Posted 03 October 2012 - 04:35 PM

Military Analysis: Leonidas.

"The Leonidas Squadron, formally known as 5th Staffel of Kampfgeschwader 200 . . . thirty-five pilots of the Leonidas Squadron flew suicide sorties (a Selbstopfereinsatz unit) against Soviet bridges over the river Oder with little noticeable effect." [during the Battle of Berlin - - 1945]

"It was named for Leonidas I, the king of Sparta who in 480 BC stopped the invading Persian army at the Battle of Thermopylae with 300 elite warriors who fought to the last man."

German authorities, those persons at the very top of the command echelon, were of mixed opinion regarding the use of suicide bombers. Some saying yea, some saying nay!

* "proposed by Otto Skorzeny and Hajo Herrmann."
* "supported by . . . Hanna Reitsch."
* "Himmler approved . . . and suggested using convicted criminals as pilots."
* "The Luftwaffe's High Command was unenthusiastic"
* "Erhard Milch turned the plan down as impractical"
* "Hermann Göring showed little interest."
* "Adolf Hitler was against the idea of self-sacrifice"

Hitler eventually reserved unto himself the final authority to release the suicide bomber for combat action."

Edited by Fred Wilson, 03 October 2012 - 04:50 PM.

Stepson of Arthur Ellison Sovereign:
RCAF Navigator: Lancasters and Wellingtons,
Bomber Command, WW2
http://www.members.s...ereign/Art.html

Named after Fred Sutherland of the Dambusters.

 

"Apple Pie without cheese is like a kiss without a squeeze."

A little quip from the nicest person I have ever known: My Dad.


#8 Fred Wilson

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Posted 03 October 2012 - 04:45 PM

Off topic meanderings...

In my dreams, the History Channel, as part of its "Battles BC" series will restage the Battle of Thermopylae.

Hopefully that will kick start tourism investment in the town. As things stand now, there is not even a Hotel there or nearby.
- I had to beg a taxi driver to find me someone who would Bed and Breakfast me for the night.

It is so cool. The ocean has moved a good mile or more east in the intervening millenniums.
You can walk along the base of the mountain just south of the Hot Springs, then walk a few steps eastwardly and hear the sound of your feet change as you walk from solid ground to ancient seabed... which nearly approximates the narrow beachhead the Persions would have had to traverse.

So cool.

So neglected. So forgotten. What a crying shame.

Thermopylae - Basics on the Persian Wars Battle of Thermopylae - 480 B.C.

Greco-Persian Wars: Battle of Thermopylae
  • green slime likes this

Stepson of Arthur Ellison Sovereign:
RCAF Navigator: Lancasters and Wellingtons,
Bomber Command, WW2
http://www.members.s...ereign/Art.html

Named after Fred Sutherland of the Dambusters.

 

"Apple Pie without cheese is like a kiss without a squeeze."

A little quip from the nicest person I have ever known: My Dad.


#9 Fred Wilson

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Posted 03 October 2012 - 05:01 PM

There is a book out now on KG 200 but no reviews. It's hype certainly sounds good!
Has anyone read this? Worth buying? tnx Fred!

Kg 200: The Luftwaffe's Most Secret Unit

"Shrouded in secrecy and intrigue during its lifetime and myth and legend since its dissolution, the KG 200 still remains for many one of the most fascinating units of the Luftwaffe. Delivering spies while flying captured Allied aircraft, clandestine reconnaissance missions over land and sea, testing new weapons such as the 'Mistel' composite bomber and the piloted V-1, and extremely long-range liaison flights were just some of their tasks. But there was also a more sinister aspect to their operations: men from KG 200 played a significant part in the notorious action against the French Resistance on the Vercors plateau, others were involved in what were effectively suicide missions. Geoff Thomas's deeply researched text throws new light on all aspects of this unit, dispels a number of myths and shows that despite its 'special' status, KG 200 was just as much a prey to the Nazi hierarchy's power politics as every other branch of Wehrmacht, with results that were often tragic but frequently farcical."

Stepson of Arthur Ellison Sovereign:
RCAF Navigator: Lancasters and Wellingtons,
Bomber Command, WW2
http://www.members.s...ereign/Art.html

Named after Fred Sutherland of the Dambusters.

 

"Apple Pie without cheese is like a kiss without a squeeze."

A little quip from the nicest person I have ever known: My Dad.


#10 lwd

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Posted 03 October 2012 - 05:54 PM

A bit OT but ...

Military Analysis: Leonidas.

"The Leonidas Squadron, formally known as 5th Staffel of Kampfgeschwader 200 . . . thirty-five pilots of the Leonidas Squadron flew suicide sorties (a Selbstopfereinsatz unit) against Soviet bridges over the river Oder with little noticeable effect." [during the Battle of Berlin - - 1945]

"It was named for Leonidas I, the king of Sparta who in 480 BC stopped the invading Persian army at the Battle of Thermopylae with 300 elite warriors who fought to the last man." ....

They rather got their info wrong didn't they? As the second link on your follow up post illustrated they only stopped them for a couple of days and the Greeks initially had about 5,000 troops with around 1,000 fighting a rear guard action (of whom none are known to have survived) once their position was flanked.

#11 Fred Wilson

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Posted 03 October 2012 - 06:42 PM

The Spartans put the fear of god into them.
The Persians (who with support / fleet personnel reputedly numbering close to a million) were badly shaken by what so few Greeks could do, with well thought out infantry tactics by perhaps the best trained land army in history.

I wish it were legal to go over the battle field with a metal detector and trace out the perimeters of where the bulk of the fighting took place.
I wish it were possible to reconstruct the defensive wall the Spartan's built, to really be able to see the battle scene as it was that day.

When the Persians got to Marathon they were already mentally defeated.
- not to mention loosing half their navy in a storm. The stuffing was knocked right out of them.

Were it not for the Spartans at Thermopylae, you and I and every other living WASP would be speaking Arabic and worshipping Mohammed.
Western civilization was "done dinner" were it not for the Spartans.
IMHO By far and away the most heroic effort and battle in human history. Epic.

KG 200 likewise was heroic stuff of ages. Brave, brave men. Aptly named.

Edited by Fred Wilson, 03 October 2012 - 06:57 PM.

Stepson of Arthur Ellison Sovereign:
RCAF Navigator: Lancasters and Wellingtons,
Bomber Command, WW2
http://www.members.s...ereign/Art.html

Named after Fred Sutherland of the Dambusters.

 

"Apple Pie without cheese is like a kiss without a squeeze."

A little quip from the nicest person I have ever known: My Dad.


#12 lwd

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Posted 04 October 2012 - 08:59 PM

The Spartans put the fear of god into them.

The Spartans or the Greeks? Remember even among those who stayed and fought to the end a minority were Spartans.

The Persians (who with support / fleet personnel reputedly numbering close to a million)

The Greeks claimed around 3 million I believe but recent analysis of the logistic constraints puts the maximum under 300K I believe and possibly under 200K.

were badly shaken by what so few Greeks could do, with well thought out infantry tactics by perhaps the best trained land army in history.

The Immortals may well have been as well trained. The tactics were pretty well directed by the terrain. The dedication and willingness of the Greeks to fight that badly out numbered and indeed for some to sacrifice themselves so that the rest could escape probably had a greater impact. Indeed that it wasn't the questionable troops that were sacrificed but the elite along with their commander was even more telling and perhaps alien to their world view.

I wish it were legal to go over the battle field with a metal detector and trace out the perimeters of where the bulk of the fighting took place. I wish it were possible to reconstruct the defensive wall the Spartan's built, to really be able to see the battle scene as it was that day.

My understanding is that the land has subsided significantly and that the pass is now a rather broad plain.

When the Persians got to Marathon they were already mentally defeated.

Or perhaps not. The Persians were reembarking to out flank the Athenians who caught them in the act. This really deserves a thread of it's own as it is rather OT here.

#13 Fred Wilson

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 02:24 PM

The Spartans at Thermopyle had put the fear into them.

By Marathon the Persions were demoralized when they saw a proper sized army

 - after the thrashing the few thousand supporting the Spartans at Thermopyle.

 

Spartan / Greek military tactics were a winner.

 

> My understanding is that the land has subsided significantly and that the pass is now a rather broad plain.

 

Correct. It is really neat.

You can walk from the hill's edge, stomping your feet and HEAR the change to sea bed, only meters from the hill.

Now kilometers from the oceon.

 

Now if someone would only rebuild the hotsprings resort....

 

> The Greeks claimed around 3 million I believe but recent analysis of the logistic constraints puts the maximum under 300K I believe and possibly under 200K.

 

Correct. But ONLY if you are counting fighting men.

Heroditus counted the cooks, carriers, shipping crews, livestock handlers and trainers, iron workers.... etc etc etc

 

Uni Cross reference studies with the stated numbers of Persions from each town coincides with Heroditus's statistics vs each towns capabilities.


Stepson of Arthur Ellison Sovereign:
RCAF Navigator: Lancasters and Wellingtons,
Bomber Command, WW2
http://www.members.s...ereign/Art.html

Named after Fred Sutherland of the Dambusters.

 

"Apple Pie without cheese is like a kiss without a squeeze."

A little quip from the nicest person I have ever known: My Dad.





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