Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

German "Maus" Tank


  • Please log in to reply
58 replies to this topic

#1 Nathan S.

Nathan S.

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 44 posts

Posted 08 July 2003 - 07:40 PM

I was just reading a book on "German Secret Weapons", and came across the "Maus". I guess it was suppose to dwarfed the Tiger II. The Tiger II weighed 156,747 lbs. and the "Maus" weighed 425,488 lbs. It's main gun was a 15cm KwK 44, it's secondary weapon was to have been the 7.5cm gun (Panther's main gun). Also it had 2x 7.92mm MG 34 machine guns on it.

What else does anyone know about it?

#2 Martin Bull

Martin Bull

    Acting Wg. Cdr

  • TrusteeOKF Trustee
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 12,768 posts
  • LocationLondon, England.

Posted 09 July 2003 - 06:23 AM

'Maus' was quite preposterous but exerts a considerable fascination. I'm quite sure that apart from possible use as a (barely) mobile fortress it would have been a waste of time and effort.

Ther's one left at the Russian Tank Museum at Kubinka & I'd love to see it someday...

http://www.members.a...nka/kubin3a.jpg
"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson

#3 Kai-Petri

Kai-Petri

    Kenraali

  • ModeratorsOKF Moderator
  • 20,307 posts

User's Awards

2   

Posted 09 July 2003 - 08:10 AM

Indeed,

Hitler was with Maus really going too far with his " the bigger the better" ideology...

Here´s some sites:

Nice 3D site on Maus:

http://models.gunpoi...model-Maus.html

facts:

http://freespace.vir...irefly/maus.htm

http://www.achtungpanzer.com/pz7.htm

;)
Posted Image

#4 Martin Bull

Martin Bull

    Acting Wg. Cdr

  • TrusteeOKF Trustee
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 12,768 posts
  • LocationLondon, England.

Posted 09 July 2003 - 09:40 AM

Neat little graphics on the 3-D site - I like it ! ;)
"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson

#5 Nathan S.

Nathan S.

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 44 posts

Posted 10 July 2003 - 05:14 PM

Martin-
I definately agree with you about how preposterous this tank was and the facination about it. My "specialty" in WW2 is aircraft, but I've always had this facination for the heavy German Tanks. I don't know what it is. Mabye it just the thought of seeing one of those break throudh a house wall, or come crashing through some brush, and how in a sense, they seem almost "unstoppable".

#6 reddog2k

reddog2k

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 231 posts

Posted 10 July 2003 - 06:03 PM

Were any Maus tanks actually built?
"Family, friends, religion. These are the demons you must slay if you are to become successfull in bussiness. When opportunity knocks, you don't want to be sitting in some phoney-baloney church... or a SINAGOGUE!" - Montgomery Burns

#7 Schmidt

Schmidt

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 101 posts

Posted 11 July 2003 - 12:10 AM

Two, maybe more, but they were prototypes and I am clueless towards any effect/role they played.

I've even seen design works for Maus IIs, these things never got pasted the drawing board, but they were titans, one man believed he could slam around ten 88mm Self-propelled on the thing.

Their were best off producing more Panthers and Tigers, the Maus sucked up alot of resources and to no avail it seems.
"In war there are no excuses. Victory needs none, Defeat allows none."

#8 Martin Bull

Martin Bull

    Acting Wg. Cdr

  • TrusteeOKF Trustee
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 12,768 posts
  • LocationLondon, England.

Posted 11 July 2003 - 06:30 AM

That's right, they only reached prototype stage and I'm not even sure if guns were ever fitted.

The closest type which saw any active service was the 'Jagdtiger'.
"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson

#9 Mahross

Mahross

    Ace

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,587 posts
  • LocationLondon, UK

Posted 11 July 2003 - 09:28 AM

There were 9 prototypes in various states of completion. the 2 that were finished were blown up at Kummersdork before it was overrun by the russians. This is why the Kubinka Maus is a 'mut'. Read this article:

http://freespace.vir...irefly/maus.htm

[ 11. July 2003, 04:42 AM: Message edited by: Mahross ]

#10 Greenjacket

Greenjacket

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 324 posts

Posted 11 July 2003 - 06:28 PM

I can't see the Maus as being anything other than a complete and utter waste of investment, being little other than a massive aiming point for the tactical air forces of the RAF/USAAF/VVS (USSR's air force).

#11 wilconqr

wilconqr

    Dishonorably Discharged

  • Dishonorably Discharged
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 940 posts

Posted 11 July 2003 - 07:27 PM

Seems like the Germans would have learned their lesson with extreme weight from the "Ferdinand/Elefant" SP's on the Eastern Front. Even the weight of the PzKpf VI gave them some troubles as I remeber.

[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]


#12 Bish OBE

Bish OBE

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 762 posts

Posted 17 July 2003 - 11:56 AM

Originally posted by Mahross:
There were 9 prototypes in various states of completion. the 2 that were finished were blown up at Kummersdork before it was overrun by the russians. This is why the Kubinka Maus is a 'mut'. Read this article:

http://freespace.vir...irefly/maus.htm

There are some suggestions that these two were actually deployed. From what i remember, one was said to have broken down on route, the other taken out by enemy fire.

As to the original post, everythjing i've read says it was armed with the 12.8cm gun, not a 15cm.
'England confides that every man will do his duty' Nelson
'I'm a Norfolk man, and glory in being so' Nelson
Posted Image Posted Image
Proud to be a GRUNT

#13 Mahross

Mahross

    Ace

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,587 posts
  • LocationLondon, UK

Posted 21 July 2003 - 07:54 AM

Yeah i've just read a different account which claims that one was used at Kummersdorf and the other was used to defend OKH headquarters. Just goes to show how little we know about the last hours of the Reich.
  • Von Poop likes this

#14 Mahross

Mahross

    Ace

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,587 posts
  • LocationLondon, UK

Posted 21 July 2003 - 08:12 AM

Here's the beast. It was even painted to be ready to go into combat. I have got somewhere the scheme it was supposed to be in.

Posted Image


http://www.wwiivehic...rmany/maus.html

#15 TheRedBaron

TheRedBaron

    Ace

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,122 posts

Posted 21 July 2003 - 10:16 AM

I believe that two did attempt to engage russian forces at the end of the war. One i think ran out of fuel or broke down, the other I have read reports of engaging JSII's but this may have been in some rather fanciful history so will check it out. The Kubinka one is defo post war, the damage to it was done by soviet weapon tests. None of the hits penetrated the hull, by the way...
"Watch that Fu*ker, he'll 'ave someones eye out!" King Harold at Hastings 1066.

#16 redcoat

redcoat

    Ace

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,370 posts

Posted 21 July 2003 - 08:10 PM

While the stories about the Maus being used in action are entertaining, German records show that both prototypes were destroyed before the Russian advance reached the testing ground at Kummersdorf.
if in doubt....Panic!!!!

#17 Vermillion

Vermillion

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 114 posts

Posted 24 July 2003 - 06:49 PM

Greetings:

Indeed, as several have stated, the Maus saw no action in combat. Of two prototypes, one of them was not even fitted with a turret.

The Maus wouldhave been pretty much impenetrable to enemy shellfire, but then again, the majority of German big tanks, like the Tiger II were taken out by aircraft.

The maus moved at 9 km/h, and was fitted with a snorkel to cross rivers, as no bridge would support it. It was utterly silly.

Germany should have stpped with the Panther and the Tiger I, and worked on improving those models, rather then creating new ones.

#18 wilconqr

wilconqr

    Dishonorably Discharged

  • Dishonorably Discharged
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 940 posts

Posted 12 May 2007 - 04:26 AM

The following site shows a Maus with a "wading trunk." With such weight how could they expect this to work?
www.lonesentry.com/articles/maus

[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]


#19 Za Rodinu

Za Rodinu

    Aquila non capit muscas

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,809 posts
  • LocationPortugal

Posted 12 May 2007 - 10:29 AM

We need a GIF for back-from-the-dead threads :D

Quousque tandem abutere, Catilina, patientia nostra...


#20 Von Poop

Von Poop

    Waspish

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,270 posts
  • LocationPerfidious Albion

User's Awards

2   

Posted 12 May 2007 - 10:57 AM

Always good for a laugh though :spin: ;

the majority of German big tanks, like the Tiger II were taken out by aircraft.


And who on earth gave the Baron and Ross negative rep in their absence! seems most unfair.

The Maus/Kummersdorf/action thing intrigues me more and more as time passes, I used to easily dismiss it too but there's a few photographs out there along with personal accounts of locals that at least make me see enough doubt to be interesting. The most intriguing personal account has one setting off with that odd cobbled together Kummersdorf unit and breaking down on the short march to meet the Russians at a crossroad near a local settlement, pretty standard end for a German heavy. Great contemporary photograph of it from a local chap in the schiffer Kummersdorf book.
It's only the Internet...

#21 Vince Noir

Vince Noir

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 134 posts

Posted 14 May 2007 - 10:22 AM

There is a photo that is suggested to be of a Maus destroyed by Soviet gunfire.

It is on a road near residential housing. It is certainly a Maus, but looks to have been destroyed by an internal explosion.

I am undecided as to the fate of the Maus prototypes. From what I have been able to ascertain, from people far better informed than me, it seems likely that only one turret was fitted with armament during the war.

The main theory seems to be that the one in the photo I mention above was being sent to fight the Russians and either broke down or ran out of fuel and was destroyed by the crew.

The Kubinka variant is a post-war hybrid of several proto-types. It was used for weapons tests by the Soviets and was built by them after the war.

I guess we will never really know what went on in the last days of the Reich...
"The Americans will always do the right thing ... After they've exhausted all the alternatives."

Winston Churchill

#22 Sloniksp

Sloniksp

    Ставка

  • TrusteeOKF Trustee
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,495 posts

Posted 14 May 2007 - 04:29 PM

Personally I would choose the JS-3 over the Maus any day of the weak ;)

http://gunpoint-3d.c...ork/aw-Maus.jpg


http://www.weapon.df...ar/foto/Is3.jpg
The war against Russia will be such that it cannot be conducted in a knightly fashion. This struggle is one of ideologies and racial differences and will have to be conducted with unprecedented, unmerciful and unrelenting harshness. -Adolf Hitler


#23 Vince Noir

Vince Noir

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 134 posts

Posted 14 May 2007 - 06:40 PM

But the JS-III never saw action in Europe in WW2 either... Despite the comments of some so-called experts in their books!

Ugly looking tank!
"The Americans will always do the right thing ... After they've exhausted all the alternatives."

Winston Churchill

#24 Sloniksp

Sloniksp

    Ставка

  • TrusteeOKF Trustee
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,495 posts

Posted 14 May 2007 - 06:50 PM

If im not mistaken, only a hand full of JS-3 were completed in 1945. Also from what I have read, regiment of JS-3's may have been deployed to Manchuria in 1945...

Ugly looking tank!


Which one??
The war against Russia will be such that it cannot be conducted in a knightly fashion. This struggle is one of ideologies and racial differences and will have to be conducted with unprecedented, unmerciful and unrelenting harshness. -Adolf Hitler


#25 Vince Noir

Vince Noir

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 134 posts

Posted 14 May 2007 - 07:20 PM

Some did go to the Far East... What they did there is open to debate.

Not alot that the Japanese had would have stopped one of those beasties though...

Both are equally ugly!!! :)
"The Americans will always do the right thing ... After they've exhausted all the alternatives."

Winston Churchill




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users