Yamato verses Iowa

i guess since there are no topics in this category guess i'll start!
lets think of topics to discuss for fun...
If by chance a Japanese battleship of the Yamato class engaged a US battleship of the Iowa class...who do you think would come out on top and or what variables would have an effect on who would win. IE night or day/ speed/ armor/ guns/ etc.

 

Yamota Hands down the thing was Huge. The American Battleships were alot like Pocketbattleships swift and heavily armed but the Armorement of the Yamota would have destroyed the Iowa.

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Out side is America!

 

I think that it depends on variables as to who would win...Yamato or Iowa. The Yamato had thicker armor and heavier guns. The Iowa had smaller guns and armor that was not as thick.
Looking at that you would attomatically think the iowa would loose. Not so...most of the naval engagements of the war took place at night. The Americans (by the time the Iowas were in service) had pretty much perfected radar for their warships. Where as the Japanese lagged behind. Had the battle been fought at night the americans would have won; for The Iowa class could stay out of effective range firing accurate shots. The Iowa's offensive armament were smaller than that of the Yamato...but 16' is nothing to scoff at...many hits of 16' projectiles could do much harm even to the Yamato.
Even though the Yamato's 18.1' guns could fire farther than the American's 16'. The darkness would have forced the Yamato to come in closer to the Iowa to hit effectively. However, being so heavy could not keep up with the faster Iowa's. The Iowa's could stay in effective range while keeping the Yamato's out of their effective range. This i think would have prob. forced the withdrawl of the Yamato.
If the battle was in daylight I think the Yamato had a good chance of winning a one on one battle. As long as visibility was good the Yamato would win...in times of bad visibility or night the iowa's would have won.
Also the Iowa's were in no way like "pocket battleships" their tonnage were around 45,000-55,000 tons. There guns were one of the larger sizes 16'. There armor was very thick. I would compare the Iowa's to Germany's Bismarck. The only reason the Yamato seems so much better is it is practicly a class of it's own. A super battleship. but the Iowa's are surely a battleship and not a pocket battleship...which is basiclly like a battlecruiser.

 

I've got what you're looking for: http://www.combinedfleet.com/baddest.htm

Everything you always wanted to know about WW2 Battleships but were afraid to ask.

 

thanks that was interesting!

 

Hi guys. It was found after the war, that there wasn't a major difference in penetration power between an 18" AP shell and a 16"AP shell. Both could easily penetrate thick, armour belt armour. It's my belief that the key determiner in any big-gunned engagement between ships, would be the degree of reliability and accuracy of radar-guided firecontrol. If the above holds true, then the Iowa's carry the day against the Yamato's. But,that is only my opinion.

 

Really? i sware i heard the 16' had better penetrating power because their velocity was faster?

 

I think that the Yamato or the Musashi would have blow up the Missouri or the New Jersey if they had engaged each other. The 50.000 tons Iowas were faster and their radar capability was superior to 75.000 tons Yamato-class battleships. But the Japanesse sailors and officers in those ships were an elite in the Japanesse fleet. They had an advantage of experience against the americans. But I do agree that it would not have been a cheap victory, because americans showed themselves they could fight as well as the experienced Japanesse.

Admiral Yamamoto and
Admiral Hedaeki Togo

 

I agree with John. The later class of U.S. battleships were very acurate.And I aree with ron about the night fighting. If the Iwoa was faster then she could have stayed out of range untill nightfall, then closed in with her radar and fire control.

 

I think the US would win for reasons already outlined. A nice night engagement where they could use their radar would have allowed the US to dictate the battle. It's not a matter of actually sinking the enemy, rather neutralising their offensive capability, and the US 16" guns would have been more than capable of doing the job.

Jumbo

 

Elite??

>75.000 tons Yamato-class battleships. But the Japanesse sailors and officers in those ships were an elite in the Japanesse fleet. <

Doesn't say much for that "elite" when the Yamato couldn't even take out DESTROYERS and CVE's at Samar. The biggest American gun opposing the Yamato was a 5"-er. Only ONE CVE out of six were lost. Can't win if you can't HIT!

Iowa hands down!

 

I think this is now the record holder for the oldest thread restarted -- started almost 12 years ago, last post almost 10 years ago.

That being said, I think the Iowa is superior due to its radar-guided fire control system. If that isn't enough remember that the Iowas had a 5 knot speed advantage and a higher rate of fire.

 

I have read that the gunnery skills of the IJN, especially those aboard the Yamato were suspect at best. It cost far too much for them to practice their big gun marksmanship, which had deteriorated by that point in the war to the point shown in their actions off Samar. Other readings found that other sailors in the IJN referred to the Yamato the "hotel Yamato" due to their inaction and staying in port most of the time. So, I say the Yamato would have been lucky to stay in the ring with an Iowa class BB. Once an Iowa closed to within distance of their big guns (whose accuracy and effective range was close to 24 miles with the benefit of radar) and began firing, the fat lady was already singing (for the Nips).

I'll close with saying "what's the use of having the biggest battleship ever in the world and being afraid or not being able to use it". In this case, "better having it and not needing it" does not help.

 

re: "old post"----Yeah, I thought I would look deep into the "archives" to see if any subjects caught my interest. I just finished reading "Last Stand of the Tin Can Sailors" (EXCELLENT book) and it talked about the dismal performance of the "mighty" Yamato--so I thought it relevant to bring up against those who would "gush" at the supposed prowess of the Yamato.

 

Yes, that is a good book. I think his other book "Neptune's Inferno" is even better. Check it out if you haven't read it.

 

It's not clear if she landed a main battery hit. One of the CVE's was apparentlly damaged by one of her main gun rounds however. Guess it depends on what you call a hit. I'm pretty sure she got at least one hit on one of the tin cans as well. Part of the problem was she had fired very few round even in training. Her first main gun salvo was a stradle and at over 30,000 yards. I'm not sure she had fired enough rounds for them to automatically acount for barrel heating though and I don't think she had time to get back on target due to doging torpedos, smoke, and rain.

 

>Guess it depends on what you call a hit. <

Yeah, we might have to dive on the wreck and see if there are 18"-diameter "wormholes" through the ships! Yamato's shells were AP and delayed-fuzed, so most likely even if she had actually hit the CVE's the shells would go out the other side before detonating.

 

From what I recall only one of the CVE's was sunk and Yamato has been pretty much ruled out in her sinking. I think the one damaged may have had one of Yamato's shells detonate either under her hull or fairly close by producing splinter and shock damage. Yamato's spotter plane did report a hit on the first salvo but none of the CVE's did. Likely a puff of smole as they went to emergency power and started deploying smoke screens mislead the spotter.
This page suggest that Yamato was firing a mix of AP and Type 3 rounds:
Battles of the supership Yamato
It's from the Japanese stand point and makes a number of errors describing the US side but not sure how accurate their Japanese info is. Combined fleet has some of the same info at:
Imperial Battleships
The Japanese did manage a lot of stradles. White Plains reported that by the laws of statistics they should have been hit a number of times and defintily felt some pretty heavy shocks. The near miss that casued her to loose steering control may also have produced some splinter damage. That wasn't noticed till after the action I beleive. See:
Chapter 6 - BOSAMAR.COM
The Battle of Leyte Gulf: 23-26 October 1944 - Thomas J. Cutler - Google Books

 

Hello,
I'm new on here so I'll throw in my two cents.Halsey wanted to be with his fast carriers while they were attacking Ozawa.If he would have detached his flag ship (New Jersey) and left the rest of Task Force 34,we would have our answer.
Caualties?1583 were killed or missing,two escort carriers,twoDD's,and 1 DE sunk after the battle,how many US casualties would resulted in a Taskforce 34 vs.Kurita center force engagement.I'm guessing at least one battleship lost in DEEP water.
What if McCain had been left there instead of heading to Ulithi?
I'll check back in 12 years and see if anyone posts.Ha Ha,just kidding