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Finally: Justice for Assange ...


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#1 Tamino

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 03:08 PM

... and shame for western "democracies"!

On December 11th, 2010, one of my the most favorite members of this community, Volga Boatman from Australia, wrote:

It is no accident that Julian Assage faces charges from established power players.

His site, WIKILEAKS, has set the tone for embarrassing governments.

Julian is a political prisoner, and the journalistic community in Australia is outraged by the treatment of the man. We, in Australia, do not tolerate political prisoners. No-one should.

Free Julian Assage!!!!


Amen to that!

The thread was closed.

16 AUGUST 2012: Ecuador has granted Political Asylum to Assange!

Justice for Assange : Now, after 619 days under house arrest, Assange is under the protection of the Ecuadorean embassy. The Ecuadorean government has found that Mr. Assange has justified in his application and through additional material that he has a well-founded fear of political persecution, and risks torture or the death penalty in the United States in connection with the publication of truthful information of matters of interest to the public through his work with WikiLeaks.


WHY Western Democracies Prosecute Assange! Why was he expulsed?

On my knees I beg American patriots and other "Democrat" zealots to refrain from heated debate, to avoid closure of this thread.

Edited by Tamino, 17 August 2012 - 03:16 PM.

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#2 The_Historian

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 05:06 PM

If he's so innocent, why did he flee to the Ecuadorian embassy rather than the Australian one?! That in itself is suspicious.
If I got into trouble in a foreign country, my OWN embassy would be the first place I would head.

Regards,

Gordon


#3 Tamino

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 05:40 PM

If he's so innocent, why did he flee to the Ecuadorian embassy rather than the Australian one?! ...

Because all 16 requests for assistance are refused in full by Australian government! It would have been much easier to surrender to Americans outright!

Assange is innocent!

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#4 brndirt1

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 05:40 PM

If he's so innocent, why did he flee to the Ecuadorian embassy rather than the Australian one?! That in itself is suspicious.
If I got into trouble in a foreign country, my OWN embassy would be the first place I would head.


Perhaps because of extradition treaties?
Happy Trails,
Clint.

#5 Tamino

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 05:54 PM

Perhaps because of extradition treaties?

There is something even more than just official treaties. Many countries are too enthusiastic for collaboration with US Government inoficially. The former Slovenian Prime Minister Mr. Pahor has secretly negotiated with US officials to take over several Guantanamo prisoners to Slovenia in return to be invited to visit the White House! Politicians have their own logic.

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#6 The_Historian

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 07:44 PM

Because all 16 requests for assistance are refused in full by Australian government! It would have been much easier to surrender to Americans outright! Assange is innocent!


That's a bit of a contradiction, isn't it? If his own government doesn't believe a word he says, why the hell should the rest of us?

Regards,

Gordon


#7 The_Historian

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 07:53 PM

Perhaps because of extradition treaties?


No, it's because they would have no legal right to represent him-
"As the Consular Services Charter makes clear, the Australian Government can neither represent Australian citizens in legal proceedings in foreign jurisdictions nor intervene in those proceedings on their behalf. "
Declaration of Abandonment - Justice for Assange
This whole thing is turning into a paranoia-fest for anyone desperate to blame the US for everything.
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Regards,

Gordon


#8 Victor Gomez

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 07:54 PM

If he is so innocent, the best tactic would be to go to court with your strong case of being innocent. When one cavalierly puts our operatives at risk with wide open exposure, one has taken lightly the responsibilities for other's lives. He did not just release the matters he thought were of misbehavior.....he released it all let the innocent be murdered by the terrorists. The entire free world must respect the ugly job our operatives must do to completely protect us and preserve our home freedoms. By handling the materials in this manner he insured that he could not be thought of as simply a vehicle of exposure. His actions with the girls seem to exhibit the same kind of irresponsible behavior in his personal life. Get him to trial and let us all see the details of his actions as heard by a court of law in the free world. There are many things "Western Democracy" can improve themselves on, however letting our operatives get exposed for this weak principled individual isn't amongst those things. Get a hero if you want to make a hero and admire him. If this guy is your choice, it only reflects on you. I do not agree that we should torture anyone and many in the free world hold strongly to that sentiment, it will take time for things to sort out.....if we abandon principles we take steps backward not forward. I want to move forward but acknowledge we sometimes take steps very backward and I am sad for that.

#9 Tamino

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 08:04 PM

That's a bit of a contradiction, isn't it? If his own government doesn't believe a word he says, why the hell should the rest of us?

The official position of Australian government proves nothing. Their point of view just reveals that they would hand over Assange to America.

Now, imagine that Assange has revealed top secret of the state of Parador, for example. Would Australian government even bother issuing an official statement. They would perhaps nominate Assange for Nobel Price for Peace! Do you see where is the difference?

Assange is just a warning to others.

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#10 The_Historian

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 08:05 PM

I would have thought the females in Sweden were entitled to justice too, since Australia keeps trumpeting about how progessive it is now, and that misogyny is a thing of the past.

Regards,

Gordon


#11 The_Historian

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 08:06 PM

The official position of Australian government proves nothing. Their point of view just reveals that they would hand over Assange to America.


No, that's just paranoid BS.

Regards,

Gordon


#12 The_Historian

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 08:10 PM

This would tend to suggest that Australia is a long way from being an American poodle-
"Australia, which tries to tread a fine line between supporting its closest ally, the US, and not upsetting China, its biggest trading partner, yesterday rejected a proposal to base a US nuclear aircraft carrier group near Perth, saying it did not want American bases in the country.
The idea was raised in a Pentagon-commissioned report by the influential Washington-based Centre for Strategic and International Studies, which suggested relocating a carrier and its support fleet from the US east coast to HMAS Stirling, an Australian naval base south of Perth, as part of a new strategic focus on Asia."
Australia rejects proposal to base a US nuclear aircraft carrier group near Perth - Australasia - World - The Independent

Regards,

Gordon


#13 Tamino

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 08:11 PM

... The entire free world must respect the ugly job our operatives must do to completely protect us and preserve our home freedoms. ...

Does this mean that Assange is a traitor? If a country has secret organizations doing their dirty job away from legal system, then all of us are potential targets, including you Gomez.

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#14 Tamino

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 08:15 PM

No, that's just paranoid BS.

I gave you a "like" for this post just because you used very nice abbreviation: BS. :)

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#15 Victor Gomez

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 11:16 PM

I don't know what you are referring to but I would say many of our operatives are law abiding.....you are the one who came up with words "away from the legal system" so you cannot put words in my mouth sir. When you twist and turn like that .....well you are just slithering and as far as me being targeted......you are probably right about that but here I am free to speak and talk about it too. What I mean by ugly may not be illegal just unpleasant for family people that would rather be home with their families. I happen to know and am even related to people involved in intelligence and they have lived their lives depicting the highest moral values of anyone I know and done so without recognition that normal soldiers get. If there are activities Assange wishes to reveal then he should leave the "innocents" just doing their normal job alone and reveal the evil. He didn't do that, he revealed everything. He cared not at all for innocents so he is like the terrorists who target the innocents. When you have no standards, you cannot claim a moral path.

#16 von_noobie

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 11:20 PM

No, that's just paranoid BS.


Very nice use of BS there, But if it is so please do inform me of what there official position is? Because as far as I can tell anything to do with China and the US as long as it doesn't involve both if one says jump then the Australian government asks "How high?"

Oh and as for the Swedish rape allegations, Do you know that with there law's it has basically become a man is guilty until proven innocent? Or that reports commissioned by the European Commission (2009) and Amnesty International (2008) criticized the Swedish rape laws.

One point being in the Amnesty International report was that
- "the evaluation and analysis of rape cases is largely dependent on the motivation, knowledge and attitude of the investigators."

#17 TD-Tommy776

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Posted 18 August 2012 - 12:47 AM

:eatpopcorn: :drink_a_pint: :eatpopcorn:
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to remember that sacrifice, and offer some sacrifice for themselves if Freedom is threatened.

Cecil Earl Workman, WWII Veteran, "L" Co., 129th Inf. Regt., 37th Inf. Div.


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#18 The_Historian

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Posted 18 August 2012 - 01:21 AM

I gave you a "like" for this post just because you used very nice abbreviation: BS. :)


Thanks, Old Boy!:D

Regards,

Gordon


#19 George Patton

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Posted 18 August 2012 - 01:29 AM

WHY Western Democracies Prosecute Assange!


His organization spilled a good amount of their secrets and publicly embarrassed several high-level officials in the US. If someone hacked your computer and posted everything on the internet, wouldn't you be a bit peeved as well?

Also, why isn't this in The Stump?

Another thought -- have the Assange supporters considered that the charges against him could be true? I've rarely seen anyone raise this question. If I wanted to extradite him to the US, I certainly wouldn't turn to Sweden and "encourage" them to make up some "fake" assault charges just so that he can eventually end up in a US court. Why couldn't they have just got the Brits to arrest him for some crime and then ship him directly to the US?

Edited by George Patton, 18 August 2012 - 01:46 AM.
spelling

Best Regards,
Alan

#20 The_Historian

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Posted 18 August 2012 - 01:34 AM

Very nice use of BS there, But if it is so please do inform me of what there official position is?


Well, I already did. The Australian government pointed out that it can't represent any Australian citizen accused of anything under a foreign jurisdiction.

Because as far as I can tell anything to do with China and the US as long as it doesn't involve both if one says jump then the Australian government asks "How high?"


Clearly not, since the Australian government just told the Pentagon to get stuffed where a nuclear-powered aircraft carrier group was concerned.

Oh and as for the Swedish rape allegations, Do you know that with there law's it has basically become a man is guilty until proven innocent?


Thanks to feminists, that's been the case for about 30 years.

Or that reports commissioned by the European Commission (2009) and Amnesty International (2008) criticized the Swedish rape laws.


Amnesty are an unelected, unaccountable and unrepresentative pressure group. Outside student union bars, no-one actually cares what they think.

Regards,

Gordon


#21 George Patton

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Posted 18 August 2012 - 01:40 AM

Amnesty are an unelected, unaccountable and unrepresentative pressure group. Outside student union bars, no-one actually cares what they think.


Off topic, but I lost the very small amount of respect for them during the Libyan Revolution. They routinely put out statements supporting the rebels in response to regime-perpetrated war crimes (even when it was apparent that the rebels too were engaging in war crimes), and then as soon as the NTC took power they called for immediate investigations into their conduct. Pick a side and stick to it, don't just stir the pot in the name of 'justice'.
Best Regards,
Alan

#22 The_Historian

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Posted 18 August 2012 - 01:43 AM

I know, they can't help themselves.

Regards,

Gordon


#23 von_noobie

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Posted 18 August 2012 - 03:47 AM

Well, I already did. The Australian government pointed out that it can't represent any Australian citizen accused of anything under a foreign jurisdiction.


If that was the case then there would be no need for Embassies and Consulates, The Australian government routinely as do most every government get involved with the citizines when they are facing crimes in another country, How is it the Government will get involved for a person that tried to smuggle drugs through Bali but a person wanted by the US and Sweden gets pushed to one side?

Clearly not, since the Australian government just told the Pentagon to get stuffed where a nuclear-powered aircraft carrier group was concerned.


You forget the part where I pointed out that they don't jump when it involves both the US and China. With the saber rattling China made over a marine base in Darwin even considering basing a Nuclear carrier battle group in Australia is simply insane. But to put it correctly, It was a proposal by a think tank, It was not an actual request by the US Government or USN.

#24 Tamino

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Posted 18 August 2012 - 06:57 AM

Thanks, Old Boy!:D

You're welcome mate. Quite obviously, affection between us is mutual. ;)

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#25 SKYLINEDRIVE

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Posted 18 August 2012 - 07:20 AM

The assumption that, of all, the US of A and Sweden are concocting to cash in on Assange with made up rape charges is outright hilarious! And I'm trying to be very curteous in the choice of my words because I have a huge respect for some of the posters! But seriously, this is Monty Python at it's best!

BTW: There is no right for the public to know all, there are laws and that's all, everybody has to abide to them, even Anonymous and Assange. If a majority of the people object to these laws they can have them changed by their elected representatives!




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