Buchon article. pilot said it outrolls Spit & for crosscountry flying was in some ways better than Stang. The usual 11.000 landing accidents figure is given, yawn. Mentioned being very fun to do aerobatics in. Very maneuverable, but required 2 hands. The paint scheme was Werner Schroer's red tail design.

Article covered the Caldwell-Schroer meeting. Every time I read something about that encounter, it is written differently. This time Caldwell shot down Schroer's wingman after being set on fire & so on.

Another article mentioned Caldwell scaring both of em off after being hit.

I think what happenned is he was hit by Schroer,plane caught fire, he opened his cockpit to bail out, & Schroer decided he'd had enough & went off, Caldwell jumped back in, flames went out, & he made it back to base.

http://www.elknet.pl/acestory/caldw/caldw.htm

For fun, I'll list the different versions I can dig up.

Caldwell became separated from other members of his squadron and was returning to base. He was attacked by two Bf 109s. One of his attackers was a Messerschmitt Bf 109e-7 known as "Black 8", piloted by one of Germany's top aces, Leutnant Werner Schroer of Jagdgeschwader 27. (Schroer would eventually be credited with 114 Allied planes in only 197 combat missions). Although his Tomahawk was hit by over 100 7.9 mm bullets and five 20 mm cannon shells, Caldwell destroyed one of the Bf 109s in a running fight, and heavily damaged "Black 8", causing Schroer to disengage.

Schroer and his wingman attacked RAF Tomahawks over Tobruk, setting one on fire and claiming a victory. Unfortunately for the Axis powers, Schroer’s victim, Australian Clive Caldwell, although wounded and nursing a crippled aircraft, did not crash. Caldwell not only limped back to base, he shot down a 109 on the way,

He was bounced by Messerschmitt Bf 109E’s flown by Luftwaffe ace Lt. Werner Schroer (Item# 7102) and his wingman from JG 27. Schroer set Caldwell’s Tomahawk afire and wounded Caldwell. Schroer decided the burning Tomahawk was done for and flew away. Caldwell sideslipped his Tomahawk to extinguish the fire and prepared to bail out, but when he noticed that the fire had stopped, he attempted to limp home. But on his way back to base Caldwell spotted another pair of Bf109’s, shot one down and hit the other.

Anyway, you get the picture. & how do we know Black 8 was damaged?

Herer's Schroers Red tail.

http://hsfeatures.com/features04/bf109g2trop32ir_1.htm

http://www.beuliland.com/html/perfil.../plate010.html


On 29 August 1941 Clive Caldwell was attacked by two Bf 109s North-West of Sidi Barrani. Caldwell's P-40 "Tomahawk" was riddled with more than 100 rounds of 7.9 mm slugs, plus five 20 mm cannon strikes which punctured a tyre and rendered the flaps inoperative.
In the first attack Caldwell suffered bullet wounds to the back, left shoulder, and leg. In the next pass one shot slammed through the canopy, causing splinters which wounded him with perspex in the face and shrapnel in the neck. Two cannon shells also punched their way through the rear fuselage just behind him and the starboard wing was badly damaged. Despite damage to both himself and the aircraft, Caldwell turned on his attackers and sent down one of the Bf 109s in flames. The pilot of the second Messerschmitt made off in some haste. Caldwell's engine had caught fire, however he managed to extinguish the flames with a violent slip and nursed his flying wreck back to base at Sidi Haneish.


While flying over the Mediterranean on 29 August 1941, Caldwell felt his P-40 Tomahawk jolt as a pair of Me-109s began firing at him. His cockpit suddenly filled with smoke, part of his instrument panel disappeared, and huge chunks were missing from the wings and trailing edges of his aircraft. Wounded in the shoulder, back, neck, and left leg, he opened the canopy to bail out. But, when the canopy opened, the windblast extinguished the fire in the cockpit and Caldwell decided to remain with the aircraft. While crossing the Egyptian coast near his home base, he observed a dogfight in progress and, instead of landing, he gradually climbed his damaged fighter for an attack on an Me-109F. Only after downing the Messerschmitt did he return to base and successfully land his aircraft despite a flat tire and no wing flaps. Doctors removed the bullets from Caldwell and he returned to his flying duties 2 days later.

Seems a bit of inventive writing has occured along the way. Makes it hard to determine with exactitude what actually went down.

"Although Caldwell's Tomahawk was hit by over 100 7.9 mm bullets and five 20 mm cannon shells, in a running fight, he destroyed the 109 accompanying Schroer and heavily damaged "Black 8", causing Schroer to disengage."

Right, with his engine on fire he shot down a 109 in a running fight & damaged Black 8 & scared off Schroer. What nonsense.

Seems interesting I guess. This thread wins the award for the most fragmented and difficult to follow threads ever made here on the WWIIF. Looks like a classic case of the poster assuming that all readers are familiar with what's in chrome's head. My guess is this is why no one else has gotten involved. I'd like to know what the heck is going on here, but I don't feel a like making a research project out of it. Moving along now...

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<--The man

The posts are all different versions of the Caldwell/Schroer meeting, but agree, it started as a Buchon post. It can be both.

Here are some more Buchon quotes from the article.

You can 4 point roll this aeroplane with ease, it's also nicer in roll than the Spitfire.

On ferry flights I found the Buchon a very fast, economic cross country aeroplane. In some ways better than the P-51.

Very impressive power to weight ratio, enormous manoeurverability.

Always wonder about that, on one hand, he mentions it takes 2 hands, but then says enormous manouerverability. Almost seems like a contradiction in terms. Perhaps it will maneuver very well, just takes 2 hands to do it.

Wish a flyoff comparison between a G-10 & a Buchon article would appear. The Buchon has old G-6 style tail, rudder, & elevators. G-10 had upgrades in those areas.

[ 15. November 2006, 01:42 AM: Message edited by: chromeboomerang ]

That's not what I meant chrome, re-read this thread from the prespective of some who doesn't know a single thing about this topic. If you do, you will see that this thread is completely confusing, as you give no background and jump right in, kind of like entering a conversation in the middle. As well, in your last post you said "On ferry flights I found the Buchon a very fast, economic cross country aeroplane. In some ways better than the P-51." Am I to assume you have flown the Buchon and a p-51?

No offense, but this thread is an absilute clusterbang.

__________________
<--The man

Well, here is the beginning of the thread. Quite simple really, just excerpts from the Aeroplane magazine Buchon article. Nothing much confusing about it.

"Buchon article. pilot said it outrolls Spit & for crosscountry flying was in some ways better than Stang. The usual 11.000 landing accidents figure is given, yawn. Mentioned being very fun to do aerobatics in. Very maneuverable, but required 2 hands."

Here's some Spanish Buchon shots. Curious about the hood guns that appear on some of these. If they actually worked, & if so why did not the Spit & Stang have this worked out.

http://www.fag.es/sevilla/tablada/la...inglaterra.htm

The 'cowling guns' were mocked-up for the movie 'Battle of Britain' when the aircraft were made to look as much like Bf109Es as possible ( the wingtips were also removed ).

__________________
"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson

They also had Rolls Royce engines !

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Work Harder ! Millions on welfare are depending on you.

Yah, that's what I mean. Rolls Royce engine with hood guns, why not Spit & Stang?