Models are always fun to look at and I would guess that this is a copy of an actual vehicle. But, the question I have from looking at this is why would the German's had felt a need to retain the hull and rear turret mounted machine guns, which are quite redundant for an artillery support vehicle, with the spare ammunition tubes being carried on the rear of the vehicle. Surely, if there was a chance that it might get caught in the middle of an infantry ambush, where having the vehicle swamped by enemy combatants, they would have not carried such supplies on the vehicle exterior. Also, if you look at my previous pick (as I just noticed) you can see the same rack of tubes on the vehicle rear.

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The original poster's photo is of the 1939 model of the KV-2. As far as I know it was only a prototype. The turret was different (obviously) and the external fuel cells were different as well.

Yes, the Germans did capture a few of these (as well as anything else the Russkies made) and used them in service. There are photos of one even being used in the defense of Berlin. The other pics posted here are of a retrofitted KV-2 that was used in North Africa. The idea being it would be safer to use it there than back on the Ostfront where it could easily be the victim of friendly fire. (Most gunners fire on a target based on its silouette.)

One KV-2 did halt an entire Panzer division for a day, or so. It couldn't be knocked out. Eventually infantry mined it, or were able to get grenades inside the turret. I forget the exact tale.

Lastly, the reason the turret couldn't rotate when the tank was inclined was becaue it was manually operated. The poor crew just couldn't crank the turret.

This is all from memory, and has not been checked for accuracy. I'm sure more, better, info can be found on the web.

Later!

The following site says something about their use by German forces on the Eastern Front.....I wonder where the entire story is?.?.?.?. Four pages of the KV2 in all.

www.beute.narod.ru/Beutepanzer/su/kv/kv-2/kv-2-2.htm

And here is the story of Soviet Tanks in German Units: Captured Tanks in Frontline Units from the same site.....

http://www.beute.narod.ru/Beutepanzer/su/su_trophy.htm

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I'll take a hip shot here. I don't think the story is all that interesting. As the Germans fell back they were desperate for weapons to defend themselves with. I expect they used whatever useful Russian weapons fell into their hands.

I've been reading a biography of Jochen Peiper. There is mention of using Russian anti-tank rifles. So, we know the Germans were scrounging for material as the retreated.

It would be interesting to find KV's, T-34's etc listed as on strength in German lists.

Well, the site says that German sources state around 50 KV's in German service and their being used in certain Panzer Divisions on the Eastern Front. Until I saw something closer to a primary sourse on the issue I'd remain open to the possibility before closing all possibilities to what I'd read in a book about the young Peiper.

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I am not dismissing any possibilities. I agree with you.

Although I think the then 28 year old Peiper was older than any of us will ever be. At least let us hope so!

Careful with that "around 50" figure, I noted it when referencing the Beutepanzers site initially and as it just refers to 'KV' it appears to include both KV1 & KV2.
There's plenty of OoB's out there with listings of beutepanzers serving with German units, got a feeling that Jentz's second volume of 'Panzertruppen' has some listings, I'll check. I'd recommend the Schiffer series on vehicles 'Under the German Flag' too, kind of flimsy but some excellent photographs.
(I presume nobody needs to see that film of a T34 in German colours being fairly recently dragged from a Russian swamp again?)

Cheers,
Adam.

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"Wars cannot be fought with dream stuff" - Sir Percy Hobart.

Yeah, I think the site I referenced says 50+/- KV 1 and KV 2.

I haven't seen this film. Is this the show on The History Channel? where they fix up an old rusted WWII tank (can't remember the name of it)? I did see the one where they found the Panther under an ice flow in a river somewhere in Poland? maybe???

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Different one to 'Tank Overhaul' mate:

Main site (looks like the restoration is going well):
http://www.diving.ee/articles/art035.html

Videos (with apologies to those that have seen them... I still think they're marvellous):
http://www.diving.ee/video.php?f=T34-1.mpg
http://www.diving.ee/video.php?f=T34-2.mpg
http://www.diving.ee/video.php?f=T34-3.mpg
http://www.diving.ee/video.php?f=t34.AVI

I'm sure this has been mentioned before too but there has also been a lake recovered KV1 restored to running order in Russia recently:
http://www.trizna.ru/kv1/photo.htm
http://www.opensea.ru/articles/travel/kv2003/
(There's a video of it running out there too, can't find it now.)
Amazing work for a relic of the Nevskij bridgehead.

Cheers,
Adam.

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"Wars cannot be fought with dream stuff" - Sir Percy Hobart.

Thanks for the heads up! I just can't fathom how that thing remained in such fine condition after ? years. Is it that the water is just that fresh and cold? They really look like they were just ran in and then back out of the water. The fifth video down shows them running an engine. Presumably the T-34 once they got it fixed up back in the shop?.?.?.?.?

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Is that a T-34/41? (or w.e the name was given)

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Time is only enemy you'll never get rid of.

Nice find Von!

As the article is in Russian, here is the translation.

This was a KV-1 which was sunk while crossing the Neva on its way to reinforce the " Невский Пятачок" or " Nevsky Pyatachok ". During the siege of Leningrad this was a small area of about 50 acres completetly surrounded by the Germans. The tank was on 4 wooden rafts trying to cross when hit by enemy artillery. The rafts broke apart and the KV-1 sank ( parts of which were found with the tank).

Here are some sites with some pictures of the area and history.....

http://www.nortfort.ru/np/foto1.html

http://www.oblmuseums.spb.ru/eng/mus...ml#ancContents

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The war against Russia will be such that it cannot be conducted in a knightly fashion. This struggle is one of ideologies and racial differences and will have to be conducted with unprecedented, unmerciful and unrelenting harshness. -Adolf Hitler

A sclicing of more info-

No. Produced : 334
Length :6.8 meters
Height :3.3 meters
Width :3.25
Weight :52000Kg

Compared to T34/76 model 1942
Length :6.75 meters
Height :2.45 meters
Width :3 meters
Weight :30000Kg

So it was a rather big tank!
Heres a picture for you to print off and colour in.

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And I must say, quite an ugly tank.

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The war against Russia will be such that it cannot be conducted in a knightly fashion. This struggle is one of ideologies and racial differences and will have to be conducted with unprecedented, unmerciful and unrelenting harshness. -Adolf Hitler

Ugly or Pretty, I wouldn't like to see it crawl towards my pillbox!

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(there's no KV2 Smilie, so A Tiger will have to do.)

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I remember reading about one of the first times the Germans had to deal with one of these things. The 50/37's were nothing but door knockers to it, but they finally knocked off the track(s). Two disastrous attempts by engineers to reduce it during the night also failed.
Some 88's were brought up (from wherever they were) to deal with it. The KV-2 got two of them before they could get set up.
One 88 then put two rounds through the back of the turret. End.
I don't remember how many hits it took, or how many weapons/men it took out before it died, but I'm sure they got their money's worth !

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"Danger Will Robinson!"

I believe it was a KV-1, in fact I am certain because the turret had the rear overhang for the ammo. It was somewhere around Orel (?) I believe and the KV-1s had orders to prevent the Germans from taking the railroad yards. The German retreated into a town and the KVs followed them, bad move. I think it was Eichman or Bach.

The KV-2 on the bridge held out for almost 3 weeks blowing the hell out of anything that showed itself. They tried mines which removed the treads but couldn't blow the tank. There was only rear echelon troops available to remove it also, the front line having moved far to the east. Someone finally got a batallion of PZ3s on the scene and some 88s. While the PZ3s attacked from the front the 88s moved into the rear of the tank and blew it to pieces. This I am sure is a KV-2.

And lost many panzers in the process.

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Thanks Chuikov, That is the incident I remembered.
When and where was it ? So I can find it again in my books. It was a total shock to the Germans, and something (at the time) right out of the war of the worlds. Invincible monster stuff.

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"Danger Will Robinson!"

The incident of the tank on the bridge I'm not sure. I have been told it happened at Brest and near a village called Pavelkovo west of Minsk. I read a very interesting account of it in the Smolensk library which seems to be the most accurate and only states that it happened west of Minsk. Keep in mind though that during that time no one really knew where anything happened. When? July or August?

I do not think it was in Brest because the Citadel there held out for a long time but they had no tanks. At least not kvs.

It depends on how much air, specificly oxygen, is disolved in the lake water. Those sort of lakes frequently have 'dead' water begaining a couple meters below the surface. Without the dissolved oxygen there is very little corrosion. If silt or other inert sediment quickly covers the metal then corrosion is highly inhibited. Conversely a lake or river with a steady circulation of water from surface to bottom will have pleanty of dissolved oxygen for corrosion. If the water is acidic then the corrosion occurs all the more quickly.

The timber industry used to take advantage of 'dead' lake water to sink & preserve surpluss logs, instead of building expensive storage sheds. Occasionally forgotton caches of now rare hardwoods are turned up to the delight of cabinet makers.

Remarkable page on the KV2 posted by a Russian gent on a.n.other forum:
Translated version of http://mechcorps.rkka.ru/files/kv2/kv2.htm
(Quite long loading time... Many pictures)
Appears to be an attempt to correlate pictures of every example made, quite fascinating.

Cheers,
Adam.

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"Wars cannot be fought with dream stuff" - Sir Percy Hobart.