I will probably cop some flamage for this, considering its my first post and that so many people seem to be quite bias and defensive.

I think the most overated plane of the war was the P51 Mustang, I agree that it was an excellent plane however it wasn't as special as everyone makes it out to be. It did not solely win the war as many people like to claim. The effectiveness of strategic bombing is questioned and other planes in the US arsenal could of been effective in protecting the bombers, most namely the P47 and P38 and yes the later versions did have the range!

It is also a misconception that the P51 was the best dogfighter of the war, once again this isn't true many Axis and Allie fighers could outperform the Mustang. The beauty of the P51 was the fact that it could be pumped out in so many numbers. Its hard to put up a decent fight when you are hopeless outnumbered. It was a very good planes yes, but it wasn't as special or important as everyone makes it out to be. There are many better planes that saw service in WW2.

Also laughing at whoever classed the ME109 as overated, its of opinion that after the introduction of the Spitfire that the 109 was obsolete, in the hands of a well skilled pilot the ME109 was more than a handful for Allied fighters throughout the war, even in the later stages. The P38 (a plane i didnt even like) is i believe underated rather than overated, it doesnt get the credit that it deserves for the role it played!

First of all welcome to the forum mate

Ok this is untrue what you have here everyone here has there own opinions on different aspects and are intitled to these opinions.

So how many other planes were actually use on these long range escort duties compared to the mustang? It is not a matter of other planes being effective at the same role as to what wins the war, and in this case I'd say numbers and mustangs well, there were just more of them for this role, and how many P-38 or P-40 went against the Me109 and ruled over it compared to the Mustang?

You are right but where in this thread have never been all equal on the p51 being the best dog fighter of the war, every fighter was best in its own roles until it was classed obsolete by newer models, if anything it would have to be the spitfire and the Me109 if we are comparing this to the european threatre

Where is the post about the Me109 being overrated?
The spitfire and the Me109 were virtually all but equal at around 15000 ft which is generally where bombers would fly during the BoB and higher the Me109 was better and lower then it the spitfire and hurricanes manouverbility won over it. HOwever don't in anyway think that anyone here underestimates to abilities that the 109 held over the allied planes such as the more powerful engine and swoop and shoot tatics, in my opinion in the hands of equal skilled aces all these planes were just as lethal as each other.

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They shall grow not old as we that are left grow old Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemn
At the going down of the sun and in the morning
We shall remember them. Lest We Forget

Hello Butts, and welcome to the Forum !

Yes - a bold first post, but I sincerely hope you won't feel 'flamed'....

We all feel a certain amount of National pride about these aircraft which is only natural, and I'd agree that some people tend to denigrate other fine aircraft by 'over-egging' the P-51D.

But I'll repeat one story which I'm sure I've used here before. I had the privilege to converse many years ago with a highly-decorated RAF 'ace' who had flown just about every Allied aircraft - Spits, Mossies, Hurricanes, Thunderbolts, even Gloster Gladiators....

I asked him which was the best, and without hesitation he replied 'the Mustang'. I was a lot younger then, and was amazed that he hadn't said 'Spitfire' His own opinion was that the P-51 had the 'edge' because it was very easy to fly ; in combat, you could concentrate fully on shooting down the enemy. A relative novice could look good and fight well in a P-51, but not in a Spitfire.

His comments made a big impression on me and, despite my love of Spitfires and Typhoons, I have to rate the P-51 along with the Fw190 as possibly the best combat fighter of WWII.....

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"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson

I was wondering too. Who mentioned the ME-109 in this thread?

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For the first time I have seen "History" at close quarters,and I know that its actual process is very different from what is presented to Posterity. - WWI General Max Hoffman.

Another good possibility was the Me 163 Komet. This was a complete waste as a fighter system. It was dangerous to fly, dangerous to land. It was too fast for its weapons systems making it virtually impossible to actually make successful attacks on targets under power. Without power it was a very vulnerable glider that was almost certain to be shot down if enemy fighters were about. On top of all this, its range was so limited that the only way it was a threat was if the enemy was stupid enough to fly almost directly over its airbase.
In all, the Me 163 could have been better described as an experiment in how best to get the pilot killed rather than a useful fighter aircraft!

I think every air force in that era and even today had thier share of aircraft where they had high hopes and then had them dashed when they were actually used in combat. Many believed the hype of the designers and represenatives,ect put out.

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For the first time I have seen "History" at close quarters,and I know that its actual process is very different from what is presented to Posterity. - WWI General Max Hoffman.

Sorry guys I thought someone mentioned the Me109 as being overated, I must of been seing things!

P38's and P47's were used quite substantially in long range escort roles. The P47N although arriving later is a fine example of an excellent long range escort that could have been used. The P47 and P38 could hold their own against a ME109 dont worry about. Many German pilots feared a well flown P47 a lot more than a P51. Dont forget the Vought Corsair which could also have been a very very good escort fighter. The Corsair offers better performance than the Mustang and was IMO the best US fighter of the war. My point is that just because there were soo many P51's doesnt make them an excellent plane!


Please guys don't want you to think I'm canning the P51, it used to be my favourite plane and remains one of my favourites, however reading more into WW2 over the last years has opened my mind a bit. It was an excellent plane but I am still of the belief that it has been overated, it was not invincible as many people seem to think! I agree it was one of the best fighters of the war but it didn't single handedly change the war and cream every other fighter as many believe.

For those interested I consider the FW190 and TA152 to be the best overall fighter of WW2!

Gardner while nobody will doubt that the Me-163 was a failure and that Germany shouldnt havent bothered with its production, its in flight performance is absolutely incredible for the time! It really was pretty amazing although it only lated 8mins under power.

Somehow I doubt that this Mustang pilot cares whether his plane was overrated or underrated

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They shall grow not old as we that are left grow old Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemn
At the going down of the sun and in the morning
We shall remember them. Lest We Forget

german: me-109G
japanese: raiden
american: p-38
british: spitfire mark V

i think a better way to answer is to name the weapons produced in large numbers, released in a timely fashion, and failed to live up to expectations.

the ju-87 was a sitting duck even to lee enfields but it was used EFFECTIVELY. the me-262 and the ta152 were brought out too few and too late.

So your choices here are based on this?

Quote:i think a better way to answer is to name the weapons produced in large numbers, released in a timely fashion, and failed to live up to expectations.

So the spitfire V was overrated as well as the ME109G this I don't understand

__________________
They shall grow not old as we that are left grow old Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemn
At the going down of the sun and in the morning
We shall remember them. Lest We Forget

the britons literally had to wait for the mark IX to finally have something to throw against the focke wulf. the 109G series was a disappointment over the previous F. bad handling, obscured line of sight, shorter range.

I have to agree with Pzjgr that the Zero is an overrated aircraft. It's good for it's time but once its opposing pilots develop tactics against the Zero, the Zero was at a disadvantage. Case in point is the P40 over China. Once the Flying Tigers learned to use the P40 in diving against the Zero, it was downhill for the Japanese pilots.

As for the P-51, I have to agree that there are a lot better planes. But an aviation expert explained why the P-51 is considered as one of the best overall fighters of all time. "The P-51," he said, "was good enough." In other words, the P-51 was efficient. That was its edge. Other planes may fly faster or higher but the P-51 was a pilot's airplane.
How many World War II era fighters went on to the 1950s to dogfight a Mig and shoot it down?
I know that some German WWII aircraft remained in service in the Spanish air force after WWII but these didn't go toe to toe with a Mig.

I have to disagree with the Me109G although it did have its problems its shorter range was not one of them. The Me109G was designed to take a 66Gal drop tank under the fuselage during bomber interceptions, and being underguned was not an issue being that the Me109G was ussually equipped with 2 13mm MGs on the engine and three 20mm cannons one in the nose and one each on the wings giving it one hell of a punch, as well as 210mm rockets under each wing. Also the powerful engine gave the Me109G great power in a climb, and plus the plane was not designed to have what was being done to it, to put it simply the 'G' model was too heavy with a far to powerful engine for the the small wings and tail surfaces for the 109.

However with the overladen aircraft with all these extra 'kits' involved with the plane came with a price such as lower dog fighting ability but we must remember that during the time this model came out the war for the Germans was on the verge of turning so reduced performace for power and shooting down bombers was all that was needed. The biggest problem with the Me109 overall was the fact that it's models were pushed too far.

__________________
They shall grow not old as we that are left grow old Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemn
At the going down of the sun and in the morning
We shall remember them. Lest We Forget

Oh and to this how many British rifles brought down Ju87's during the war? you do know it is not easy to shot down a plane even if you are in another plane?

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They shall grow not old as we that are left grow old Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemn
At the going down of the sun and in the morning
We shall remember them. Lest We Forget

Come on, Terry, I'm drooling already

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I second that. The Stuka was no more vunerable than any other 'dive-bomber' un-escorted.They were dive-bombers, not fighter-bombers.

The B-17. Without fighter escort, it never really was a "flying fortress."

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And of course along with the F4U Corsair and P-51 what other fighter aircraft served into the 70s .

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For the first time I have seen "History" at close quarters,and I know that its actual process is very different from what is presented to Posterity. - WWI General Max Hoffman.

Since the thread runs six pages you can peruse it yourself. Pages 3 and 5 in particular have devastating responses by moi:

The Forum of the 1.Jagdmoroner Abteilung - Allied possibilities to counter Me 262 offensive?