Speaking of Elefants...

CrazyD · #1 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 01:26 PM

A few years back, I managed to find the Elefant in the collection of the Aberdeen Proving Grounds Ordinance museum. It wasn't "in the collection"- but down a road by a ralroad loading dock where it had fallen off a crane. Suffice it to say, condition was less than perfect:

Well... I did some poking around, and found... /drumroll/

http://planetarmor.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4997

Quote:

Comments on the Newly Repainted Elefant at the Ordnance Museum by Thomas L. Jentz, Panzer Tracts
Surviving photos that have been found to date of the Elefant with tactical number 102 do not have sufficient contrast to determine the exact camouflage pattern on all surfaces. However photos of three other Elefants from the same unit, the 1.Kp./s.Pz.Jg.Abt.653, reveal that the camouflage style and pattern varied significantly on each one. From early 1943 to the August 1944, usually camouflage patterns were sprayed on by personnel from the maintenance workshop following the general guideline that camouflage patterns were to be different on every vehicle, gun, tank, etc.
In February/March 1944 the refurbished Elefants left Nibelungenwerk with a base coat of RAL 7028 (Dunkelgelb). At this time, general orders instructed units to apply RAL 6003 (Olivgruen) and RAL 8017 (Rotbraun) to create camouflage patterns that would best blend in with terrain in their operating area.
The attached photos of the newly repainted Elefant provide an excellent example of how spray painting camouflage patterns causes the color to vary based on the number of passes. With a single pass the base coat still shows through, medium coverage is achieved by two passes, and a much darker shade is the result of three or more passes.
The new paint job does not have the same dull "Matt" finish of the paint used during the war. However it should be recognized, that a thin coat of matt paint is not an acceptable protective coating for a museum artifact that is on display outside in the elements.
A recent attempt by a private restorer to make an authentic batch of Zimmerit using the original mixture of ingredients was not successful because some of the chemicals are not available at acceptable costs. In addition this original Zimmerit coating quickly deteriorates on an artifact that is displayed outside in the elements. Museums in other countries have substituted a synthetic epoxy based "Zimmerit" which withstands a lot of abuse. However, the Ordnance Museum is not funded for this type of restoration. Is there someone so interested in exacting authenticity that they are willing to donate the funds needed to get a coating of synthetic "Zimmerit" applied to this Elefant? Their generosity would be greatly appreciated.
The staff and new director at the Ordnance Museum should be thanked for creating a camouflage pattern on this Elefant using paint colors that are close enough for government work in matching the original RAL 7028, RAL 6003, and RAL 8017 colors. They should be congratulated for having added one more unique specimen to the few members currently in the exclusive club of authentically painted Panzers. The Tiger I and Pz.Kpfw.III Ausf.L at The Tank Museum in Bovington, England and a Jagdpanther in the SdKfz Foundation in Kent, England are also members of this exclusive club. This small cadre are now available as a useful reference source for those who desire to paint their models accurately.
Sending your thanks and congratulations for a job well done to the Ordnance Museum at their email address: museum@ocs.apg.army.mil will encourage them to paint additional Panzers in authentic camouflage colors and patterns. This will help create a great reference source for the modeling community which currently depends heavily on erroneously colorized drawings in publications as references.
Thomas L. Jentz, April 6th 2008.

Wow. Awesome. And to top it off- at the end of this month, I'm visiting my kick-ass in-laws. Who live in MD. So not only will I be bringing back a few cases of beer from Bell's Brewing and Troegs Brewing, but I'll have a complete set of pictures of this new partially restored beauty.

PzJgr · #2 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 01:32 PM

Exellent. I am glad that it was not an abandonded project. Is there a figure on the zimmerit finish?

CrazyD · #3 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 01:42 PM

Not that I'm aware of- I literally JUST found this info this morning, so you know as much as I do after reading the post from Jentz.

I'll see if I can get some more info at the end of the month when I visit the museum, but that will depend on being able to find/talk to people.

I'm honestly shocked to see it (partially) restored. I expected it to simply rot away, as it wasn't even in the collection but down a side road. Kudos to the ordinance museum.

Hopefully some of the other specimens they have there get the same treatment, as some of the ones in the outdoor "musuem" area are in really bad shape.

Von Poop · #4 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 01:51 PM

CrazyD you're a star.
That's a question that's been bugging me for nearly 2 years, since this thread of yours:
An unfortunate end...
Lovely to see the old dear in better fettle.

there's been a lot of work by the Aberdeen collection recently, their Tiger was just restored in England and several other vehicles are scattered around the world being tidied up, or on long lease. I do hope they've not left it too late for their rarer exhibits, like the hydrostatic drive Mark IV.

Cheers,
Adam.

Za Rodinu · #5 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 03:24 PM

Not bad, not bad. Even the damage on the front was preserved and highlighted. A pity about the zimmerit, but it's better to leave it out than make a hash of it.

I found the comment:

Quote:

... how spray painting camouflage patterns causes the color to vary based on the number of passes. With a single pass the base coat still shows through, medium coverage is achieved by two passes, and a much darker shade is the result of three or more passes.

somewhat asinine, though

Martin Bull · #6 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Von Poop

CrazyD you're a star.
That's a question that's been bugging me for nearly 2 years, since this thread of yours:

Yes, me too.....great to see that something positive has been done with this rare vehicle !

Von Poop · #7 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Za Rodinu

somewhat asinine,

I got the impression that might have been aimed at some specific modeller/forumite's comment Za.
This is the mighty Jentz after all!

I'd be perfectly happy to be a bit patronised by him.

(I do wish Panzer-Tracts were a smidge cheaper though. You have to be seriously interested to splash out on such worthy but dry tomes.)

Cheers,
Adam.

CrazyD · #8 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 03:54 PM

We can only hope they give the same treatment to some of the other vehicles there. The Hetzer- the museum had cut away parts of the armor and installed screens so one could see the interior.

Including the abysmal amount of mold and debris (including empty beer bottles) that was residing in said interior at the time.

Did I mention that I'll be posting a thorough photo update in less than a month's time?

Za Rodinu · #9 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Von Poop

I got the impression that might have been aimed at some specific modeller/forumite's comment Za.

(I do wish Panzer-Tracts were a smidge cheaper though. You have to be seriously interested to splash out on such worthy but dry tomes.)

I understand some people will need to have things set out crystal clear, and even then...

If some people can afford the fortunes modern bits of resin and photo-etch cost, surely they can also splurge on Panzer-Tracts, isn't this the way the market works?

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrazyD

Did I mention that I'll be posting a thorough photo update in less than a month's time?

Nooooo, buuuuuttt...

Martin Bull · #10 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrazyD

....the abysmal amount of .... debris (including empty beer bottles)

Hmmmm...was that before or after the CrazyD visit ?

FramerT · #11 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 05:54 PM

She's a beauty. The Elefant's weight was comparable to the Tiger & Panther so I wonder why the different road wheels. Were these more or less reliable than the Tiger's over-lapping wheels?

CrazyD · #12 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 05:57 PM

I'd never litter like that!

Not just 'cause I keep bottles to use for homebrewing, either

Za- I can actually do requests, if anyone needs. Modeling, curiousity, etc. Between the wife and I, we've got plenty of extra memory cards. I plan on doing a full-on photo study of the Elefant and some pics of the other vehicles/items there, but if anyone wants anything specific, I can do that too.

Von Poop · #13 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 06:25 PM

If you're doing requests...
I'm kind of hoping they now have it hidden away being looked after, but just in case. I'm mildly obsessed with the aforementioned Panzer IV they have there bearing the unique Hydrostatic drive modification, and would love to see some better pictures of it.

Decent shots are few and far between:

And often modelling sites seem to give the best impression:
The Luftwaffe in Scale: Panzer IV with hydrostatic drive (1:35) - built by Werner Kampfhofer.

I really would be grateful for a few more shots of this rare beast.

Cheers,
Adam.

Za Rodinu · #14 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 06:35 PM

Don't worry about me, whatever is fine with you will be fine with me

CrazyD · #15 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 06:44 PM

VP- the image you linked isn't displaying, on my end at least.

But I'l look into that, no doubt. I'll post a reminder of sorts before I head down there- easy to snag a large amount of pictures, so easy to get specific if anyone has any requests that can be done at Aberdeen.

Von Poop · #16 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 07:04 PM

hydro-web.jpg

Any better?

Cheers,
Adam.

Ceraphix · #17 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 07:42 PM

Great Elefant pics!

Keystone Two-Eight · #18 (**permalink**) April 29th, 2008, 08:59 PM

Shouldve named this thread 'Elefants Graveyard"!!

Seriously though. WOW! It looks fantastic! A friend was just lamenting to me that the tanks at Aberdeen are not very well taken care of, and then this! Very cool indeed.