Exactly T.A. .

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For the first time I have seen "History" at close quarters,and I know that its actual process is very different from what is presented to Posterity. - WWI General Max Hoffman.

"Horse-drawn Transport
German Divisional horse-drawn transport was designed to be as efficient as such vehicles could be. It was issued both to Infantry Divisions and to infantry corps supply columns on a definite scale and can be divided into two major types: battle transport (Gefechtstross) and support or supply transport.
The battle transport, issued to infantry formations down to platoon level, was intended for carriage of ready-to-use supplies and heavy weapons. The intended vehicles were modern, light and often steel-bodied. Mounted on pneumatic tyres, they comprised two-horse wagons (usually the Hf 7 or Stahlfeldwagen - Steel fieldcart - and various patterns of one and two-horse limber and trailer units. The most common were the If 8 Infanteriekarren, small load carriers with tarpaulin covers and capable of taking an AA machine gun mounting; and the two-horse MG Wagen 36 with its communications variants. These were true limbers carrying 2-3 men and coupled to two wheeled caissons containing guns, tripods and ammunition, or other equipment; they were issued to the heavy-machine gun sections using MG 34s and MG 42s. Typical allocations to a 1944 pattern infantry rifle company were: HQ one If8; each rifle Zug two If8; heavy machine gun Staffel one Hf7 and two If8.
The support vehicles were often of more archaic pattern dating back in some cases to WW I and included the very widely used Hf I light field cart, a wooden vehicle pulled by two horses and various limber and trailer combinations"

THE HORSE IN THE GERMAN ARMY IN WWII « War and Game

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For the first time I have seen "History" at close quarters,and I know that its actual process is very different from what is presented to Posterity. - WWI General Max Hoffman.

Good point TA!
How about this.....................



Fuel for the German War Machine!

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Scott

The amount of feed and fodder needed for the huge amount of horses that the Germans used is just staggering. That and the other Axis countries too.

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For the first time I have seen "History" at close quarters,and I know that its actual process is very different from what is presented to Posterity. - WWI General Max Hoffman.

"The intended vehicles were modern, light and often steel-bodied. Mounted on pneumatic tyres, they comprised two-horse wagons (usually the Hf 7 or Stahlfeldwagen - Steel fieldcart - and various patterns of one and two-horse limber and trailer units."

IMO being steel bodied yet still having to be horse drawn does not smack me of being "modern" LOL.

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For the first time I have seen "History" at close quarters,and I know that its actual process is very different from what is presented to Posterity. - WWI General Max Hoffman.

<H1> <H1>
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For the first time I have seen "History" at close quarters,and I know that its actual process is very different from what is presented to Posterity. - WWI General Max Hoffman.

Yeah, really I was just joking, but my nephews have horses, and you are right! Horses require an amazing amount of attention, feed and upkeep!
I'm wondering with the amount of money spent on feed and shoes and such, if they even were shod, how that compares to vehicles! I'll bet it's not that far apart as one might think!

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Scott

Those wagons don't look the least bit modern, even as wagons go, hrmm

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No they don't do they? LOL. IIRC too that the Germans took over alot of the Soviet horse drawn vehicles when they could.

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For the first time I have seen "History" at close quarters,and I know that its actual process is very different from what is presented to Posterity. - WWI General Max Hoffman.

Not really lol. Vehicles need to be fed and kept warm and shod too LOL. Though you can't eat a vehicle either LOL.

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For the first time I have seen "History" at close quarters,and I know that its actual process is very different from what is presented to Posterity. - WWI General Max Hoffman.

Due to their function, Gulaschkanone were essential vehicles of the wartime Wehrmacht. In fact, each army division had not only a set of mobile kitchen units, but also own baking and butcher companies.
It is perhaps strange that despite all the innovations in the field of mechanization, German industry could never supply enough vehicles (or fuel) to motorize the whole army, and horse drawn vehicles and guns were used right up to the last days of the war. The Tamiya kit represents the Grosse Feldkuche Hf.13, a two-wheeled field kitchen with wooden iron-clad wheels, looking more as a relic from the era of trench warfare rather than Blitzkrieg.

The main (rear) carriage of the kitchen was essentially a moving stove, housing a 200-litre soup pot, 90-litre coffee maker with tap dispenser and a stove plate used to cook potatoes and sausages. The separate front carriage served as a seat for the coachman and the cooking crew and had a food storage space below the seats.
A single field kitchen unit could feed up to two hundred men."

Guten Apetit!

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For the first time I have seen "History" at close quarters,and I know that its actual process is very different from what is presented to Posterity. - WWI General Max Hoffman.

Guess it was a good thing they where a horse drawn army...for it took the British Empire, USA, Russia, 4 years and millions of life's to defeat an army of horses pulling weapons...imagine if they where full mechanized????had the manpower pool the allied nations could draw from, and unhindered/bomb free factories...we should toss in practically no navy of significance other the u-boats, and a lack of quality pilots/air-cover to boot.

You bet!! They were totally awesome!!!! Too bad they started to lose the war just a coupla of years into it and were beaten huh? Jeez. For the most part of the war they were on the defensive. Hell of alot easier to defend then it is to be on the offensive. And even then they were desperate. BTW the Russians were not totally mechanized and still were able to kick the German's butts.

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For the first time I have seen "History" at close quarters,and I know that its actual process is very different from what is presented to Posterity. - WWI General Max Hoffman.

You're right on bf109, not to mention the 15,000 planes, 7000 tanks (ok they were crappy US tanks but still) and 375,000 trucks plus much much more shipped to the Soviets by the US. If the Germans had only a fraction of such massive aid they would have won the war by 42. Besides they didn't really start to loose till mid 43 and even after that, with all the odds against them, inflicted way more casualties than they received.

Actually, the real fault lay with the Nazi leadership, whose bungled industry did not kick into gear until 44 (when it was way too late). The German soldier, too, was a victim of a regime that lied to him and in the end, deserted him. Very sad.

Yeah I didn't think of that!

And no, I don't think Germany could have won, even if they did have the equipment you speak of.

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Scott

After embarrassing defeats in 1941, millions more men, and twice as many tanks and planes >.<

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Ahem. The Sherman was superior to the Panzer III and IV.

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And even they still used alot of horses towards the end of the war.
And most of the infantry were good ol footsloggers.

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For the first time I have seen "History" at close quarters,and I know that its actual process is very different from what is presented to Posterity. - WWI General Max Hoffman.