Often discussed topic is of the capture of Hitler by the the Soviet Union; but what if Moscow had been captured in 1941 with Stalin still there? What might Hitler have done with him? Used him as surrender vehicle for what was left of the Soviet Union beyond the Urals......and create a harmless puppet country. Or perhaps insert Stalin as the top attraction to the already famous Berlin Zoo?

Interesting, I would probably say that it would be in Hitler's be interest to use Stalin as a propaganda tool instead of putting him into a zoo as such an act might very well just encourage the Russians to fight even harder as now their pride was attacked. A propaganda tool on the other hand might do him some good.

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The war against Russia will be such that it cannot be conducted in a knightly fashion. This struggle is one of ideologies and racial differences and will have to be conducted with unprecedented, unmerciful and unrelenting harshness. -Adolf Hitler

Far too dangerous to keep alive.
I feel reasonably sure immediate resort to the piano wire would be the most likely outcome?

Cheers,
Adam.

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"Wars cannot be fought with dream stuff" - Sir Percy Hobart.

Hey I never said what kind of propaganda tool it might be

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The war against Russia will be such that it cannot be conducted in a knightly fashion. This struggle is one of ideologies and racial differences and will have to be conducted with unprecedented, unmerciful and unrelenting harshness. -Adolf Hitler

Reguardless of how the general population felt towards Stalin at the time, I can't imagine having their former leader disgraced in Hitlers zoo would do anything but cause them to fight harder and rebel against German occupation. Then again, keeping him alive also leaves the Germans exposed to Stalin plotting against them. I think it would be better to kill him and deal with the Soviet backlash, but their is no simple decision that could cure this problem without a fight.

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Weapons are cool.

Cold shower time. That's not what happened, the "other guy" shot himself instead.

Now, back to the Twilight Zone, where Germany wins wars...

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No Rest for the Wicked!

I really don't see Uncle Joe allowing himself to be captured.

It may have not been the only reason Hitler killed himself, but he had no where to flee, with armies pretty much closing in all sides.

Stalin, on the other hand, had nearly the entire continent of Asia in which to hide, had it become necessary, which we know did not come to pass, for a myriad of reasons, mainly centering on unexpected resilience on the part of the Soviets and unrealistic goals for the Nazis, given their available forces.

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Best Regards,
JW

This is a good point. I think it would be very unlikely that Stalin would have let the German army encirlce him and then capture him. As you say, if there was no possible alternative, then perhaps he would have committed suicide. I was viewing this as if somehow some sort of elite team was sent in to take Stalin alive, this would have been very difficult, but it was worth speculating on. The capture of a figure such as Stalin would have devastated the USSR, and could have perhaps lead to their surrender.

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Weapons are cool.

Devastating yes, surrender dont know. Germans fought on till the very end, even when their entire counry was over run and even after Hilter killed himself, ( yes the population knew nothing of such news but still ) Russia on the other hand would still have plenty of hiding places for the resistance with a population still larger then that of Germany's and all of the industry way out of reach for the luftwaffe. Stalin, perhaps might have even been viewed as a martyr and a cause for the resistance.

But then again, this is a what-if,I guess anything is possible.

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The war against Russia will be such that it cannot be conducted in a knightly fashion. This struggle is one of ideologies and racial differences and will have to be conducted with unprecedented, unmerciful and unrelenting harshness. -Adolf Hitler

Slo, do you know that Frank Sinatra song that goes...

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No Rest for the Wicked!

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The war against Russia will be such that it cannot be conducted in a knightly fashion. This struggle is one of ideologies and racial differences and will have to be conducted with unprecedented, unmerciful and unrelenting harshness. -Adolf Hitler

Actually, the news of Hitler's death was released throughout Germany between May 1 and May 2 and the final surrender of Germany didn't occur until the 7th and 8th. The Germans did keep fighting after Hitler's death but by this point everyone knew what the end was going to be; the majority of Germans were simply fighting to give the civilian population enough time to escape the Russians.

I really doubt this. Even though he won the war (at least that's how his propaganda teams characterized it), Stalin's memory was quickly reviled even in the Soviet Union only a few years after his death. There was little love for Stalin in the Soviet Union; tons of fear and respect but little love. His end would have been very different from Hitler's, as the latter was still revered by many Germans even years after the end of the war, when it was known how devastating his rule had been both for Germans, Jews and the rest of the world.

One way I think this what if scenario could be envisioned is if some high level Soviet official decided to use Stalin as a bargaining chip in negotiations with Germany and seized him. Would Stalin's bodyguard have allowed this and followed the coup or would they have defended their leader with their own lives? I can't say as I don't know enough about the personal security detail attached to Stalin.

What would Hitler have done with Stalin? This would have been an enormous propaganda coup so I'm sure there would have been film made of the captured leader and shown on newsreels. Whether Stalin would have been dead or alive in the film, I'm not sure.

Stalin was considered too "huge a man" for anyone to try to get him out of power, I think. The best example of this in my view is from the early Barbarossa phase. Some two weeks into the war and Molotov and some high ranking generals and Berija ( I think Berija was also there ) went to see Stalin on his dacha. Stalin believed his moment had come because of his major mistake with Hitler, but instead the group asked for help and advice in the horrible situation. Stalin was relieved and held the speech and started leading the country again.

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I would use him to make Russia to surrender THEN kill him.

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I very much doubt that Stalin would have been captured as i can see three outcomes if German forces had Moscow encircled.

1. Stalin escapes (Pretty obvious)
2. Stalin commits suicide (i very much doubt it)
3. Stalin is assasinated by the military and Soviets sue for an armistice.

Oh and to Za old uncle Joe was fiercely hated by many in the Soviet Union and he in turn hated and loathed many ethnic groups with in his own country, he and he alone was responsible for conducting many pograms within his country resulting in some circles the deaths of nearly 25 million and if it was not for the KGB and NKDV being his power base for his reign of terror he would have been known as a failed Georgian farmer.

Thank you for the personal note.

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No Rest for the Wicked!

It´s high time for you to know about these things , Za!

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But i seriously doubt he (Za) can see through his rose coloured glasses to acknowledge the monster "Uncle Joe" was and the Communist Regimes who in both The Soviet Union (1917 to 1990, 35 million) and Communist China (1946 to present 120 million, 10 million in Tibet alone) have been responsible for the slaughter of over 155 million people and he glorifies the Communist Regimes and slams Nazism go figure.

Thank you for the personal note no.2.

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No Rest for the Wicked!

I'm closing this thread. If you want to discuss the captured Stalin scenario, start another thread. If you want to continue personal attacks, go to another website.

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Phear der PanzerPenguin!
HellFish love teh