Originally Posted by Hawkerace

Mind you the economy and strength of America and its influence in the world would put Japan out and Britain in?

edit: I don't even think the people of England would even let to the prime minister let Germany take then entire European continent!!!
Halifax would be removed and then replaced with Winston Churchill

Originally Posted by Carl W Schwamberger

I cant see Britian sitting idly by while Japan runs amok in the Pacific. Britans forigen policy in the 1920s & 30s included containment of Japan. Note that Halifax was not a pacifist. He did not favor war with Germany, but he also did not favor placing the empire at risk. Britian is very likely to be imeadiatly in the fight in the Pacific.

In any case all this comes to 1945 and nuclear bombs dropping on Axis cities across two continents

Originally Posted by British-Empire

He hasnt taken the entire European continent.

Originally Posted by macrusk

Agreed. Also agree that Alaska would not have been in isolation. Canada would certainly have been preparing itself and have Allied itself with the US. Just because Great Britain might have signed an armistice with Germany in your scenario, British-Empire, there would be nothing stopping it from changing its mind. Canada was the training ground of the Commonwealth Air Training Plan and most certainly would have been geared up in the same manner in your scenario as it was in reality. Canada would then be a launching area and supply location on both Atlantic and Pacific for Britain's Navy - also for America as it moved North. Canada only had 1 million in service over the course of the war, but they were predominantly volunteers. Those that weren't were on Home Guard. If Canada had been vulnerable, there would have been no need for the late conscription because even those who did not see the point in fighting Germany for Britian's sake, would have fought on behalf of their own country.

Japanese troops would have been extremely vulnerable to the knowledge and skills of Canadian troops who would have adapted to winter conditions for fighting. Most Americans would have also adapted and those from the South would have been assisted by those with Winter survival skills. As for the Japanese threat, as noted in the WWII Forum, the Japanese tactics were not geared for prevailing against an entrenched defense.

In all the conjecture, what has been missed is the analysis of the character of the people. Despite overunning Holland, Belgium, France, Yugoslavia, et al there were resistance groups who would have been doing all they could. I don't believe for a minute that despite an armistice, that the British would not have still been assisting those who were fighting to regain the freedom and sovereignty of their countries. The War would have dragged on for longer, but eventually the sheer numbers of people, natural resources (Canada and the US's oil reserves would have been industrialized decades sooner) and manufacturing capacity, and the character of North Americans - descended from every ethnicity - would have prevailed. It would have then been a domino effect in reverse.

Originally Posted by Sloniksp

Ah......, so your under the opinion that everything underneath stated by you would have been the likely scenerio?

Lets see if I can disect it a little






Im still baffled as to how you came up with these colorful scenerio's........ seems like the Axis win the entire war just because of Halifax. Are you implying that with out Great Britain, the Axis powers would have won? If not, what is the correlation between the unfolding of all of these events and Halifax? How did you come up with the dates and the results of battles? How did you come up with all of these countries joining the Axis? How on earth do the Japanese capture Hawaii or Anchorage?

Originally Posted by JCFalkenbergIII

All that because of one person? Too many variables and "What Ifs". Pure fantasy.

Originally Posted by British-Empire

Canada would have had the full force of the Empire behind it if she was attacked no need to side with America.
Seems a lot of wishful thinking in the above.

Originally Posted by tomcat

Having just made peace with Germany Britain isnt likely to go back to war for Yugoslavia and Greece.

I disagree, as I said they wouldn't put there own country at risk.

Britain wouldnt be at risk.


An attack on the Dutch East Indies and America would not in itself threaten the British Empire in the East and since we would not be at war with Germany and Italy the full weight of the worlds largest navy the Royal Navy and the RAF could be used to deter any Japanese aggression.

You are missing an important fact here, the Germans and the Japanese are allied as the Axis forces as well as other countries, thus if Britain goes to war with Japan because of the alliance Germany would be forced to declare war on Britain because of the alliance.

Britain isnt at war with Japan in this scenario and even if it was it dosnt mean Germany or Italy would join in.
As Japan and Italy didnt back Germany when they went to war.

The Germans alone would be able to employ atleast 40 more divisions that where used in the occupation of Western Europe for the invasion of the USSR and the Italians could use their entire navy and air force against the USSR not to mention the dozens of divisions that engaged the British in real time.
France would still be under the Vichy government and no threat to Germany.

You never said that france had been conqueroerd by Germany in the original post just an armistce, however the Germans would never shift there entire western army over the eastern front, what about partisans and the threat from britain still being there.

? In real time they signed an armistice with Hitler.

All is the same as in real time except Lord Halifax is Prime Minister instead of Churchill things only change after the surrender of France when Britain all so comes to terms with Germany.
Vichy France will still be created.

Then as I said above Britain would end up in a war wiht japan(axis) thus bringing the British to war with Germany again.

The Axis forces would have hundreds of thousands of extra soldiers, tanks and aircraft.

And you think that the Soviets would just roll over and give there country to the germans, as I have said before they can retreat for a long time back across there country and the germans don't have the man power to cover all the other countries plus the long supply lines to the front and the long front that would be created.

Just where have the Soviets rolled over?

ps. the bold is not me yelling just me showing you where my points seperate you points from mine

Originally Posted by British-Empire

read the above

Originally Posted by JCFalkenbergIII

Dont confuse his fantasy with the reality of Manpower and Logistics LOL. The Germans were having those problems with what they had in real life. Just imagine the problems being 10 fold with the universe he is proposing.

Originally Posted by tomcat

Im still trying to figure out how the japanese beat the americans and the british in this scenario, considering he said that britain would have 900 ships lol. These what if japanese sound superhuman.

Originally Posted by Shangas

After reading through this thread, I have to say I don't see Britain being able to maintain the peace. Even if they did make peace with Germany or whatever - Japanese expansion in the Pacific would have caused a war anyway - Malaya (as it was called at the time) and Singapore, as well as Hong Kong, were all British crown colonies. Japanese invasions of these countries would have meant an attack on the British Empire and thus would have brought England into the war. Perhaps a little later than when it really did, but it would happen nonetheless.

Originally Posted by British-Empire

Japan dosnt attack the Empire in this scenario.
It wouldnt dare take on the Empire and the USA at the same time.

Originally Posted by Vince Noir

Then if it doesnt take on the British Empire in the Far East it has no resources with which to persue its plans of an 'Asian Co-Prosperity Sphere'. It will be severely hampered by a lack of oil, rubber and other natural resources including foodstuffs.

I dont see how replacing Churchill with Lord Halifax makes the Japanese military leadership change their plans for expansion given that they are still fighting in China and still persuing war with America which was only a means to allow them unrestrained expansion in the Far East.

I think you are not looking indepth enough at Japanese foreign policy in the pre-war period.