I started to read the book Pegasus Bridge this afternoon and by the end of the first chapter I could not bear to read any more. I hate to say it but it is offensively inaccurate. Here is one example, Ambrose claims that Major John Howard was 31 on D-Day, fair enough. He then claims that Howard was an ex Regimental Sergeant Major. That suggests that in a maximum of 15 years (if he had joined the army at 16) Howard had risen to the rank of RSM, then recieved a commission and been promoted three more times, managed to fit in a conversion from infantry to airborne and to train with the 6th Airborne. Ambrose compounds this by claiming that Howard was an ex cop (we dont have cops in Britain, petty I know but the suggestion - which may be true - further reduced the timespan of his meteoric rise through the ranks) and that he had never seen combat. Feel free to correct any of the things I have claimed are not true, in fact I would be most greatful if people did as it may allow me to carry on reading the book (which incidentally claims that a Bren carrier is a 'tank' and that the Germans drive SPV's - apparently not something out of Captain Scarlet but 'Self Propelled Vehicles').

Has anyone else tried to read this book and found problems or found them with any other Ambrose books (which I begin to suspect may be fiction)?

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There's no honorable way to kill, no gentle way to destroy. There is nothing good in war. Except its ending.

I remember one time he was on the History Channel for his book "The Wild Blue" about B-24 crews and he stated that the low-level raid on Ploesti was on August 1, 1944 when it really was on August 1, 1943.

Greg

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"There are times when a Corps Commander's life does not count"
-General Winfield Scott Hancock at Gettysburg, July 3, 1863

I think it unfair to condemn an author simply for misstating a year. I find I am now more inclined to remember the month of an event than its year. It may have something to do with getting old.

The first raid on Ploesti, which I strongly suspect was also a low-level strike, occurred more than a year earlier. The following is taken from the USAAF Chronology:

FRIDAY, 12 JUNE 1942
MEDITERRANEAN THEATER OF OPERATIONS (MTO): 13 B-24's of the HALPRO detachment (the bombing detachment for the China-Burma-India Theater) under command of Colonel Harry A Halverson enroute from US to China take off during the night of 11/12 Jun from Fayid, Egypt to bomb oilfields at Ploesti, Rumania. Only 12 attack at dawn; 4 of the 13 land at a base in Iraq which was designated for recovery of the flight, 3 land at other Iraq fields, 2 land in Syria, and 4 are interned in Turkey. Though damage to the target is negligible, the raid is significant because it is the first AAF combat mission in the European-African-Middle East (EAME) Theater in World War II, and the first strike at a target which later will be famous.

As to Ambrose's credibility, I feel that authors who are constantly seeking to publish do not allow sufficient time for research, analysis, and confirmation of their information.

Actually, I have found a couple more mistakes and an explanation for the first. Ambrose explains the promotion later in the book (it seems Howard made RSM in five months). However he also claims that one German officer liked to use 'Stalins Organs', I didn't know the Katyusha was used by the Germans in the west. As for the date thing, when writing a reference book for which people are paying, an author should at least have the courtesy to make sure what he is saying is correct, otherwise how can one trust anything else he says? MHN, I think your last point just about summs this up, when one is trying to write a book a week (or so it seems) then it becomes clear that not enough time or effort has gone into research or ensuring accuracy.

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There's no honorable way to kill, no gentle way to destroy. There is nothing good in war. Except its ending.

I have had the priveledge (thats sarcasm) of meeting steven ambrose when he came to town, this was about 2 years ago. My personal opinions of the man are not that high. He is a socialist pinko that seems to be a biiiiiiiiit full of himself. Now, i read pegasus bridge about a year ago. Stephen, if that book is innacurate please direct me to another source so i may learn the facts of that daring mission.


CvM

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The Longest Day, an excellent book, whilst it doesn't cover the battle for the bridge in as much detail it is accurate (as far as I can tell) and it is a generally a fantastic book.

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There's no honorable way to kill, no gentle way to destroy. There is nothing good in war. Except its ending.

Wow, lucky me, that book is sitting no less than 8 feet from me. Perhaps ill pick it up after i finishing reading the Guns of August


CvM

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The late Mr Ambrose's books, while not always accurate, will have brought many people to the subject of WW2... which can't be all bad.

A much better book on this battle is Carl Shilletto's Pegasus Bridge and Merville Battery in the Battleground Europe series published by Pen & Sword in the UK. Their web site is:

http://www.pen-and-sword.co.uk/cgi-bin/uk/

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Paul Reed
Webmaster - Battlefields of WW2- http://www.ww2battlefields.info
D Day Ancestors: The British Army in Normandy - http://www.ddayancestors.com

I liked reading Ambrose's books, however a lot of the stuff he says has little fact behind it. For example he says that the Germans were surprised how the British would give up an advance to brew up tea, and that they would only fight what was expected of them. In contrast I have read several books and one of them said how a German commander was 'surprised at the dogged way of fighting' of the British troops.

Another thing that Ambrose describes in his book D-Day was the cowardice of British Coxwains during the landings at Omaha and how they were forced at gunpoint to the beach:

From:

http://hnn.us/comments/533.html

Take "D-Day. The Climactic Battle of World War II" as an example, and more specifically the chapter "Visitors to Hell", which tells the story of 1st Battalion 116th Infantry Regiment landing on Omaha Beach. There are tales in this chapter of soldiers being dumped at sea and a British coxswain being forced at gunpoint by a Captain Zappacosta to go closer to the beach. This is quite simply stuff and nonsense.

My father-in-law was the first officer of the Royal Navy flotilla which took 1st Battalion 116th Infantry Regiment to Omaha Beach from the SS Empire Javelin. He was in command of the first wave of landing craft which landed A Company 116th Infantry Regiment in front of the Vierville-sur-Mer draw at 06:30. Reading the chapter "Visitors to Hell" made his blood boil, and many other veterans felt the same way.

Taking the Zapacosta incident as an example. It simply did not happen. Reports of this incident first appeared in an article in the November 1960 edition of The Atlantic Monthly by S. L. A. Marshall. Only one soldier survived D-Day from this particular LCA landing craft, a Bob Sales who was Captain Zapacosta's bodyguard and stood right next to him all the way in to the beach. Bob Sales is still alive today and lives in Virginia. Bob Sales has tried for years to refute these accounts of Captain Zapacosta and has written notarised documents and recorded tapes to state very clearly that Captain Zapacosta did not and would not have behaved in this way. Can anyone really expect that a Captain in the US Army on D-Day would readily pull a gun to the head of a British sailor?

Furthermore, the British veterans from this flotilla have no recollection of any such incidents, for they simply did not happen. The flotilla that three companies of 1st Battalion 116th Infantry Regiment lost 8 out of 16 landing craft on D-Day, with most if the remainder severely damaged. Whilst many soldiers and sailors were killed, landing craft returned to the beach to rescue sailors from stricken landing craft and to take back some wounded soldiers. The lead landing craft for the first wave is reported as "vaporised" along with Captain Taylor Fellers of A Company 116th IR in Stephen Ambrose's book. This simply did not happen.

Jet [img]smile.gif[/img]

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And when he gets to heaven
To Saint Peter he will tell
One more soldier reporting sir
I have served my time in hell

That kind of mistake makes my blood boil, it is just plain offensive. I am afraid that pegasus bridge and the rest of Ambroses books come under my 'weekend reading' list, books that I do not feel deserve more than a weekend to read.

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There's no honorable way to kill, no gentle way to destroy. There is nothing good in war. Except its ending.

Not read Pegasus Bridge as yet, it's on my shelf thou. Read D-Day recently and thought it was ok. Didn't like his presuming stuff that can't be checked, for instance stating american soldiers were far superior to british and german soldiers. Hard to say unless they fought germans at there peak, say 1941. Did enjoy Citizen Soldiers thou but not sure how accurate it is now! stevie.

Stevie--you hit the nail on the head as to why I absolutely hate all books by Ambrose.

I as an American found it in great distaste for Ambrose to say that British and German soldiers were inept [img]graemlins/no.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/no.gif[/img] Also, that he did steal the passages he did use--more than makes my case solid for not having anything to do with any of his books.

They might be OK to read but--one really can't expect to get the unbiased outlook on a book that is fully biased. Ambrose is no Corneilous Ryan. (And I can't spell his name either ) [img]smile.gif[/img]

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Lost are only those, who abandon themselves) Hans-Ulrich Rudel.

Stef, why bother with Ambrose? He just became a cash generating machine – for himself. Your heard of Ambrose Tours? Next year, for Americans to visit Normandy, they’re asking a paltry $3’400

Why not sell any Ambrose books you have and invest in serious works?

No.9

Well said Nr 9. Also--you can visit Normandy much much cheaper than that if you just go and pick and choose where you wish to stay and visit.

My round trip to Germany and to stay there for a month plus spending about 1'3rd of all the money spent on gifts--and I still came in at maybe $2,500 maximum--but most likely a few hundred dollars cheaper. This amount also includes my flights to and from Germany.

At that time--round trip flight cost about $770.00. Most of the hotels and Gasthaus's I stayed in averaged from $27.00 a day to about $70--depending where I went. Food also greatly fluctuated and--even with all these expenses--I still managed to pay for half of Susannes petrol costs some gifts and I bought her dinner several times. All of that is included in my total expenses.

Oh I forgot to add--that I spent about $150.00 on militaria (and I was really restraining myself) over $100.00 in mailing stuff back here to the states including postcards etc. And add in a 2nd class train trip from Konstanz to Olten Switzerland--then back to Konstanz. Then 1st class train trip from Konstanz to Heidelberg--then Heidelberg to Frankfurt. I think I spent about $50.00 taking taxicabs and busses.

Also I donated about $50.00 to the Uboat Memorian in Moltenort, i'm unclear how much I donated to the Uboat Archiv in Altenbruch as well as at the Ehrenmemorial in Laboe and in other museums.

Not bad for a first timer eh? [img]smile.gif[/img]

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Lost are only those, who abandon themselves) Hans-Ulrich Rudel.

It’s a lot of money isn’t it Carl. OK, people don’t work for free, but, working in logistics myself, it begs questions? I looked up fares now for Houston/Paris return in July. They’re around $1200, but it’s a very short lead time and if you were booking now or soon for June 2004, and on a group basis, I’m sure you could put a big hole it that – I know I could. That still leaves some $2’500! Even using hotels at $100 a night – 13 nights say – that’s $1’300. Divided by two, because prices quoted are based on 2 people sharing – and that’s $650 a head. That leaves $1’850. Private bus, just say you want it for all days – which is unlikely. $900 per day x 13 days = $12’7000. 40 People on the bus (probably 47) = $320 per person. So, $1’850 goes down to some $1’530. Out of that, a 1/40th or whatever proportion of the courier/guide's 14 days wages – their flight/hotel/bus will be free, else the organiser doesn’t know how to negotiate deals with airlines etc, a few books and a couple of receptions, and if there’s not $1’200+ left, per person, I can’t see why?

The US Rangers are currently saying this about the tour:
A rough estimate of costs do not include, at this point, your departure fares from your home to rendezvous airport where trippers will assemble for flight to Europe and return. Keep in mind that airlines now add surcharges for fuel and security at airports due to terrorist threats. Buses and ferries may follow the example of the airlines. A wild estimate for the 13-day Normandy to the Rhine tour will cost a minimum of $3,700.

Brits would have a problem with the description of accommodation:
First class tourist accomodations (3 and 4 star hotels)
Rooms with private bath or shower, hotel taxes, portage and service charges

Appreciated lawful descriptions differ in Britain and the US – that’s just the way it is. In Britain if you advertise ‘first class’, it must be first class. 3 and 4 star hotels are not first class – 5 star is first class. No ‘first class’ hotel would give you a room which only had a shower! US hotel beds (proper hotels) are bigger than European beds. US hotel rooms (the North East excepted, e.g. Manhattan) are bigger than European. Most 3 / 4 star Euro hotels rooms are not air conditioned and only in Britain are you likely to get a full cooked breakfast included in the rate. Typical Euro breakfast is a hot drink and cold food/cereal.

Anyway, there’s only going to be one 60th anniversary, so why shouldn’t people make a buck or two?

No.9

Probably better off using Sommecourt Tours... [img]smile.gif[/img]

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"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson

I get to go to Normandy for free each year as I teach on the D-Day module we run...

HA HA HA HA HA...

Sorry, just gloating.

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"Watch that Fu*ker, he'll 'ave someones eye out!" King Harold at Hastings 1066.

I did a tour of Normandy once led by a Merchant Navy vet, it was brilliant and cost less than £100. No.9, you will be happy to know I have given up on Ambrose, I just wanted to finish the book (refused to give it more than 3 days). I am reading Ryan now (The Last Battle, an excellent book) and I may read some more stuff about Normandy soon, or something about the early battles, France, Poland, Norway and the Winter War, any reccomendations on those?

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There's no honorable way to kill, no gentle way to destroy. There is nothing good in war. Except its ending.

Actually Stef, my library contains almost nothing in the way of overview books with the exception of Italy, which you’re not reading. I’ve found overviews, usually are like expanded timelines, or, are a cram list of regiments, battalions etc. as the moved about?

There again, depending on your personal interests, you may or may not accept the level of specific information provided? An author might dwell quite well of infantry deployment and incidents, but mention only as matter of fact about the air raids and air cover. You in turn may want to know why certain squadrons were used and why their composition was the way it was if you have an special interest in them?

No.9

One of the best books describing the Battle of France 1940 is Alistair Horne's ' To Lose A Battle - France 1940 ' which delves into not just the military, but also the socio-political background to the defeat.

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"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson