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| WWII General Open WW2 discussion |

February 2nd, 2007, 10:18 AM
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During the first part of the war, Germany made some very smart and bold moves.
For example, the combined arms blitzkrieg had been theorized some years before the war, but I believe Germany was the first country to conceive and build weapons well suited for this task, and to pass from theory to reality.
Another example, the battle of France, when they lured the best part of French army and the BEF in defending northern front, when the main penetration occured in the Ardennes (Bulge) and then envelopped northern front allied forces.
I could also mention the very bold and audacious Norway operations, large scale airborne invasion of Crete, Rommel's feats in Africa etc...
I have the impression that Germany lost its "creativity" as time passed, was not able anymore to surpise its enemies (of course Enigma code breaking, intelligence etc... played a very important role there).
Examples : everything for Stalingrad : when Hitler diverted part of its Caucasian bound army to join the Stalingrad offensive (july or august 42), the very unimaginative Kursk offensive, stupid Bodenplatte operation, the return of the son of the Ardennes (Bulge) etc...
But maybe I'm wrong picking non representatives operations or maybe it's just allied strategists imrpoving ovetime, what do you think ?
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February 2nd, 2007, 10:38 AM
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In general terms I agree, no doubt the brilliance was spent after a while. In any case if there hadn't been a last-minut change of mind, instead of Manstein's 1940 Sichelschnitt ('sickle cut') there would have been a 1914 style offensive repeat.
I have a couple of nitpicks with the above. First I don't agree with "conceive and build weapons well suited for this task". Everybody had tanks, even the Poles had dive bombers. The difference was the Germans had much better doctrine, based on a high tempo of operations and high on individual responsibility.
Also, concerning "return of the son of the Ardennes (Bulge)", I don't agree as well because there is no doubt that the Germans had achieved operational surprise. The objective made very much sense, cutting through to Antwerp, the problem was that it was an immense gamble and there were no more means to achieve much. Together with an impending Soviet winer offensive the operation was irrealistic. But the objective was ok and the Allies were caught with their pants down.
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February 2nd, 2007, 12:31 PM
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Kenraali 
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Personally I find the main problem to be the underestimating of the enemy in several cases.
France 1940. " They can´t come over the Ardennes" or the lack of startegic reserves for the Allied.
Barbarossa: refusal to believe Germany would attack.
Ardennes : " They don´t have men or tanks to attack!"
Etc.
--------
And like we´ve seen Hitler started surrounding himself with "yes-men" and actually his view of the front was twisted to his liking ( even if battles were lost )starting Dec 1941 once he took over command of everything.
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February 2nd, 2007, 12:59 PM
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Germany did not have it all her way, lets start with Poland there is a myth that Germany smashed Poland just like that but in reality Poland put up a good fight and in some areas caused the Germans problems. Yes it’s true to say Blitzkrieg was a radical breakthrough in warfare but it’s short coming was it could not last long.
The Germany navy suffered a heavy lost during the Norway campaign and in France the bulk of the B.E.F got away with an element of the French army. In the case of Crete the Germanys could had been defeated thanks to Bletchley Park code breakers who decoded the whole plan but the decision was taken to safe guard the fact we cracked the enigma codes. Taking Crete cost Germany a high price and as for Barbarossa Jun-Dec41 that speaks for it’s self.
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February 2nd, 2007, 01:59 PM
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"Taking Crete cost Germany a high price and as for Barbarossa Jun-Dec41 that speaks for it’s self."
Nobody knew that at the time, did they? 
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February 2nd, 2007, 02:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Za Rodinu:
"Taking Crete cost Germany a high price and as for Barbarossa Jun-Dec41 that speaks for it’s self."
Nobody knew that at the time, did they?
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That's true Za.
At the time Germany was on a high note and they believed they could take Russia.
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February 2nd, 2007, 03:47 PM
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I thank you and agree with your comments folks.
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