I am absolutely shocked by the following story from the UK's Sunday Telegraph of 13.7.03:

Vienna council shifts Luftwaffe hero from plot of honour to pauper's grave
By Clare Chapman in Vienna
(Filed: 13/07/2003)


The ashes of a daredevil Luftwaffe pilot who shot down more than 250 Allied planes in the Second World War are to be exhumed from a grave of honour in Vienna after the council stripped him of his status as a war hero.

The campaign to remove Major Walter Nowotny's remains from the city's Central Cemetery and move them to a pauper's plot has been led by the grandson of a British RAF pilot who was shot down over Belgium in 1940 and died of his injuries.

David Ellensohn, a Vienna city councillor whose maternal grandfather was RAF acting pilot officer James Gillespie, successfully argued that Major Nowotny - the first fighter pilot in history to bring down 250 enemy aircraft - had been serving the Third Reich and did not deserve his heroic status.

"He was not fighting for this country, for Austria, he was fighting for the Third Reich," said Mr Ellensohn, a Green Party councillor. "If they had won the war, there would be no Austria as such. Therefore, we should not be forced to give special credit to this man."

Major Nowotny, who had shot down 258 enemy aircraft by the time of his death, aged 24, had been awarded the Third Reich's highest military honour, the Knight's Cross with Oak Leaves, Swords and Diamonds, by Hitler himself.

When the major died in 1944 when his fighter crashed in flames, his ashes were buried with his medals in his home town, Vienna, alongside Austrian resistance fighters and Beethoven, Schubert, Johann Strauss and Brahms.

Mr Ellensohn asked: "What did he do that earned him a place alongside those who really earned their places in the cemetery, such as resistance fighters Rosa Jochmann and Paul Speiser?

"He was placed in that section of the graveyard by the Nazis, not by the city of Vienna, and although it has taken 59 years for the city to recognise that he does not deserve to be there, we are pleased that action is finally being taken."

The council's decision has been denounced as "cultural barbarianism" by Johann Herzog, a councillor for the opposition Freedom Party (FP), which has launched an appeal.

Opposition councillors argue that relocating the major's ashes would contravene the war graves welfare law, from 1948, that says war graves - regardless of the nationality of their occupant - must remain undisturbed.

Mr Herzog said: "The necessity to dishonour Nowotny's grave, and therefore his person, almost 60 years after his death, is evidence of a distorted understanding of history and moreover a lack of deference for a fallen soldier. And that's all he was - a soldier.

"He was not a member of the National Socialist Party and he certainly was not a war criminal. If he were, I could understand the removal of his status. In fact, he was respected not just by his own side but by RAF pilots as well."

Sascha Gasthuber, of the far-Right Germania group, said protesters carrying flaming torches to show their contempt for the vote would march against the council's decision. "Nowotny gave his life to make sure the future was worth living in for us and our children. We cannot sit back and let them dishonour his memory like this."

Mr Ellensohn, however, insisted that the plan to move the grave away from the cemetery's section for heroes was perfectly justified. "As far as I am aware, there is no rule in Catholicism that says a grave cannot be moved, not like in Judaism," he said.

Major Nowotny, who joined up when he was 19 following the invasion of Poland, was renowned even among Allied pilots and during the summer of 1943 became a virtual one-man air force in the skies over the Eastern Front. In June 1943 he shot down 41 aircraft, 10 in one day. He crashed on November 8 1944 and was buried with his medals a few days later.

What do others think?

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Paul Reed
Webmaster - Battlefields of WW2- http://www.ww2battlefields.info
D Day Ancestors: The British Army in Normandy - http://www.ddayancestors.com

We were discussing this at the Mosquito Museum this afternoon, Paul, and I can assure you that we all felt the same as you over this absurd and outrageous scandal.

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"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson

I think this just goes to show that the wounds of the past are yet to heal. I mean, it is not as if Major Nowotny had a choice in where he was buried. It is not suggesting that he is a war hero, just that at the time, the German people were shocked by the loss of a great SOLDIER, NOT A PARTY MEMBER and wanted to give him a high honour even in death!
This is really appalling that people would go to such lengths to share their views!!! [img]graemlins/no.gif[/img]

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"GARRY OWEN"-Traditional war-cry of the US 7th Cavalry.
"CURRAHEE"-War-cry of the US 506th PIR.
"Everybody thinks that they are going to get the chance to punch some Nazi in the face at Normandy-and those days are over, they are long gone"-Lt Chris Burnett

My question is how did he earn the rank of major in the Luftwaffe without being a member of the Nazi Party?

[ 13. July 2003, 08:52 PM: Message edited by: reddog2k ]

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"Family, friends, religion. These are the demons you must slay if you are to become successfull in bussiness. When opportunity knocks, you don't want to be sitting in some phoney-baloney church... or a SINAGOGUE!" - Montgomery Burns

1. Austria was part of Germany back then.
2. Nowotny is an Austrian ace.

Don´t really understand the point of this. Was Austria taking part in another conflict on its own back then?? Sounds like another **** trying to make a name for himself and get into headlines. I think the Austrian should be proud of the man. He certainly did his duty at the time for his country.

[img]graemlins/no.gif[/img]

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[img]graemlins/no.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/no.gif[/img] I think it's disgusting that they are doing this. Nowotny was a VERY honorable man who was doing his job--which earned him notariety and hero status. I think he does belong in that cemetary resting next to Beethoven and whomever.

Damned shame on those who are responsible for this [img]graemlins/no.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/no.gif[/img] Such a TOTAL lack of respect for the dead [img]graemlins/no.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/no.gif[/img]

For Walter Nowotny (( [img]graemlins/rk.gif[/img] ))

[ 14. July 2003, 04:54 PM: Message edited by: C.Evans ]

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Lost are only those, who abandon themselves) Hans-Ulrich Rudel.

I think that he is a hero, although I can understand why they want to move him, as he is a symbol of the 3rd Reich, weather he or any of you like it or not, as I'm sure he was used for propaganda etc.

What annoys me is that they want to take away his status as a hero, and they aren't even moving him to an other good cemetery i.e. soldiers one. He was a soldier following the policies of his government, defending his homeland, it’s not like he was a member of the SS or Gestapo who had committed war crimes (nothing against the SS)

He fails to say that in 1938 the vast majority of Austria voted to become part of Großdeutschland, this involving vote tampering, and election fraud on the part of the Austrian Nazi party. The Austrians also supported to German war effort throughout the war with its industrial base as well as contributing hundreds of thousand's more soldiers for the Wehrmacht.

Regards
Phil [img]smile.gif[/img]

I would hope that Major Nowotny has some relatives someplace that would contest in court the removal of his remains. It is a good example of how extreme the Green Party can be and why it has never caught on in the US. I would think that the European Union would have some type of law in place to leave war graves and war sites alone and protect them. I agree with KP, that it is just anouther small time politician trying to make a name for himself and get his picture on the TV. A good argument could be also made of the persons RAF grandfather. A person could say that he was just a person trying to protect the British Empire and it's colonies and his grave should be dug up and moved because he represented British colonialism.

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Work Harder ! Millions on welfare are depending on you.

By being a very good pilot and fighter ace?

An honor guard has been selected to accept the mortal remains of Major Nowotny in escorting them to a place of honor located at my domicile.

He shall be laid to rest with full military honors between General Galland, and General Steinhoff.

Horrido!

Bill

This is much better news, Bill. Do you have a source for this story?

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Paul Reed
Webmaster - Battlefields of WW2- http://www.ww2battlefields.info
D Day Ancestors: The British Army in Normandy - http://www.ddayancestors.com

Gentlemen -

Excuse me, my posting was not meant to be taken as fact. It was created as a personal tribute to a man of whom I have had a great respect for these many years that I have studied the history of the German Luftwaffe during World War II.

In the 1990's, prior to Generals Galland and Steinhoff's demise, I was fortunate enough to have been able to personally write both gentlemen and receive in turn, an original autographed photo. Obviously, I could not get the same from Major Nowotny, therefore, a period post card from the RKT series takes the place.

The posting was in reference to my disgust concerning the city council members of Vienna even considering to remove him from his resting place of merit.

My apologies to anyone who is/was of the understanding that this posting was of a serious, ( but yet, written by myself in total respect, mind you ) nature.

Be good to each other.

Bill

I just received this from a friend in Wien and this was in todays Kurier of Vienna. It anin't over till it's over guys......and this does suck but it may put what the Vienese central government is thinking into some sort of light....
There are many things with in the Walter Nowotny sphere we do not know about.

This is the start of the text in Deutsch concerning the text written and given by the central board.

http://www.wien.gr.at/mdb/gr/2003/gr...-05-23-042.htm

also if you select the 043.htm
044.htm
045.htm
046.htm and
047.htm you will all have a selection of 6 pages to read through. Of course if my spelling of the addy was not a bit weird.

http://archiv.kurier.at/display.php3...11/003_001.dcs

also at the end for an additional page put in /002_001.dcs at the end instead of 003.

Here is the essence in English .....

Der Textvorschlag der Wiener Grünen

Text of the considering board...

The text suggestion of the Viennese Green party(communist !)
Former honour grave of Walter Nowotny Luftwaffemajor Walter Nowotny, leader of the illegal Hitler Youth and NSDAP member since May 1, 1938, after his crash represented as hero in death in 1944, he was a highly stylized to the figurehead(party) and buried in an honour grave of the city of Vienna. Since this the burial place was place of right-wing extremsit activites again and again and no material reason for the maintenace of the honour of the national Socailist final victory, fighter is present, the local council of the city of vienna canceled the honour grave dedication on 23 May 2003 on the initiatve of a Wehrmacht deserter......

Source: Kurier 07-19-2003

well gents all I can say is I'd like to all over these clowns at the Wien Kurier....

der Altenwolf [img]graemlins/rk.gif[/img]

and in addition and most responsible the Vienese consideration board, I puke on your guys as well......... [img]tongue.gif[/img]

It's unbelievable that the memory a man of such obvious personal courage is being treated in this way,no matter what country he fought for.

I have a photo of Nowotny's grave which was sent to me by a fellow RKT who lives in Wien and there is nothing at all about the headstone that anyone could take offence too.

Paul

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Nikto ne Zabyt . Nichto ne Zabyto.

Let no one forget . Let nothing be forgotten.

I think Paul it is a matter of who's in charge and monies. Someone found out where Walter was buried and didn't care for an ex-"nazi" to be possibly associated with being buried in the area of his/her relatives.

what a bunch of Baloney ! Next thing you know is that I'll get a private hate letter from Holtensen telling me to get my little butt over to Holtensen, Germany really fast and remove my cousins remains because his wooden cross and dates of birth and death along with the German helmet and eichenlaub sig on the cross will have to be removed because the wooden cross is out of plae amongst the concrete headstones......and besides "he" surely had to be one of those late war "nazi's" with maybe two missions under his belt........ooooooooooh !

what crap !

anyone tell that I am a little peeved ? ! [img]graemlins/no.gif[/img]

[img]graemlins/rk.gif[/img] ~E [img]graemlins/rk.gif[/img] proud to have had ancestors serve their country.....

People that fight for their countries should be honored in deed, not discraised. The fact that Austria was occupied by Germany doesn't remove his heroic efforts. The people leading the removing of his hero títle is taking it personal. Do they really believe that every soldier in the german army back then was a part of Himmlers private army? Cracy...

I salute the austrian hero major Nowotny, who fought for his country in it's hard times.

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Yours faithfully, Munken

"Veni, Vidi, Vici"= I came I saw, I conquered. - Julius Caesar.
"We shall never surrender"- Winston Churchill.
"United we are strong, united we will win"

I´m still totally shocked about this all...

but I guess that´s politics...stupid politics!

How about some real criminals like Arthur Seyss-Inquart? Why don´t they bring his name up and start talking about his doings? Nowotny´s only crime was shooting down Russian pilots..

By now in Finland the men who were for political reasons sent to prison in 1944-45 have been in many cases had their names cleared and as well shown to the public that they saved Finland from Stalin and Red Army. As such they never had any reason to be ashamed of themselves and neither has Nowotny ( if he lived to see the day ).

[img]graemlins/no.gif[/img] for this craziness in Vienna

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I can't belive this sort of thing could happen today.

having no more respect than that for such a man is preposterous!
[img]graemlins/no.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/no.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/no.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/no.gif[/img]

It seems that they think of him like Quisling.

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Yours faithfully, Munken

"Veni, Vidi, Vici"= I came I saw, I conquered. - Julius Caesar.
"We shall never surrender"- Winston Churchill.
"United we are strong, united we will win"

their thinking is stupid and messed up [img]graemlins/no.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/no.gif[/img] I can do no more than frown at this insaneness [img]graemlins/no.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/no.gif[/img] Nowotny is a hero that they should remember ESPECIALLY in these times when there are so few heroes.

They need to leave Nowotny [img]graemlins/rk.gif[/img] so he can be at peace.

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Lost are only those, who abandon themselves) Hans-Ulrich Rudel.