http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/2243082.stm

Monday, 9 September, 2002

A World War II mystery over a "failed Nazi invasion" at a remote beach in Suffolk may have been manufactured by Britain's head of propaganda, a BBC documentary suggests.

The programme suggests that Sefton Delmer, a former Daily Express journalist who organised Britain's "black" propaganda unit, may have spread rumours of a failed invasion to boost morale.

Since 1940 there have been continuing rumours of a sea on fire and a failed invasion attempt at Shingle Street, near Woodbridge, Suffolk.

Mike Paintin said that his father, a soldier during World War II, told how he was called out to pick up dead bodies from Shingle Street. "My father and the rest of his colleagues were called out to pull bodies from the sea," he said.

"The common link was that they were all in German uniforms and were all badly burned.

Thomas Waterhouse was part of the 20th Destroyer Flotilla called out to a report of enemy invasion barges off the coast of Denmark.

"The enemy were in the area, possibly invasion barges, and that put a different picture to us," he said.

"However we ran into an enemy minefield. So there were two destroyers, one sunk waiting for a rescue."

Many of the survivors were brought ashore on the East Anglian coast and it was thought to have been hushed up.

Mr Waterhouse said: "We were unable to know what happened to our casualties but it would be quite believable that for local consumption people had said they were the results of a failed invasion attempt.

"People didn't want bad news and they were prepared to go along with any cock and bull story to keep their spirits up."

Mr Knightly said this incident may have been used by the Government for propaganda purposes.

"Delmer and his colleagues in the Political Warfare Executive managed to incorporate this into the Shingle Street story to give added authenticity to the main story," he said.

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So it sounds like it could have been/taken place. Is there any more information that anyone has concerning this affair?

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Hence the saying: One may know how to conquer without being able to do it- Sun Tzu

I have never heard this story before. Afaik there was no kind of invasion try, so this is probably made up.

And there is REALLY nobody having an idea about the Stalin assassination plot?

http://www.ww2forums.com/cgi-bin/ubb...=000632#000000

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If someone tries to remove the speck in your right eye, will you turn to him the other also?

Watching the History channel the other day (Yes I know I watch a lot of Tv but I'm off work sick at the moment )

The article was about the possible invasion of the UK by Hitlers army.(Op Sealion) It would appear that they had absolutly NO method of getting massive numbers of troops across the channel. They tried to use barges that use the French canal networks but even after cutting the bows off to form a landing ramp they were not 'sea worthy' The soldiers that were due to use them found them very difficult to dissembark from and feared getting shot to bits. They had no landing craft such as used by the allies on D-day.

I know this doesn't answer the question posed by Kai-Petri, but I can't see that any large numbers of german troops could make it to England. Others may know different of course.

Regards Graham.

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Major General Gales‘ Special Order of the Day dated 4 June 1944 was as follows: "My final words to you are to see to it that what you gain by stealth you hold with guts. In the words of a great Captain, Pray to God and keep your powder dry. God bless you. GO TO IT".

So if Bargers are out of the question, what about Ju52?

The Ju52 was the aircraft used to transport the paratroops for the airborne assaults, but was also used to land troops on the airfields. The aircraft had also been used as bombers in some areas, going back to the operations in the Spanish Civil War of 1936. The aircraft had a distinctive corrugated metal skin, which is easily seen in the photos below. This made them strong and allowed them to take a fair bit of punishment. They were slow aircraft, their three radial motors only allowing a cruise speed of some 150 mph. Each aircraft could carry some 15 paratroops.

If the Luftwaffe could clear the skies above the invasion area, maybe then...

Euh, how many Ju52's did the Luftwaffe had at the beginning of the Blitz?

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I am not familiar with the story so I have no idea as to how many troops were 'found' in the area of the supposed invasion.

If it were just a few men perhaps they did come across by boat or were dropped by aircraft.

My point was that there was no way that operation Sealion could go ahead as the German forces were unable to move the numbers of men, tanks, trucks, and heavy weapons across the channel. This was because they had no suitable seaborne transport/landing craft.

Regards Graham

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Major General Gales‘ Special Order of the Day dated 4 June 1944 was as follows: "My final words to you are to see to it that what you gain by stealth you hold with guts. In the words of a great Captain, Pray to God and keep your powder dry. God bless you. GO TO IT".

The 'Shingle Street' mystery was investigated in depth by 'After The Battle' some years ago & if I remember correctly, was found to be rather like the Loch Ness Monster ie local memory and rumour wasn't too reliable !

Note to myself : I really must sort out my copies of 'ATB' so I can check things like this....

Anyhow, thanks to the wonders of technology, we can boldly go somewhere that I bet no-one on these forums has ever gone before !

http://www.cruising.org.uk/around/a_..._ShingleSt.htm

[ 23. November 2003, 01:16 PM: Message edited by: Martin Bull ]

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"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson

Attempts to land an invasion by Ju-52 would have been disastrous.

Indeed - 'the last Spitfire' would have had to have been conclusively destroyed for a Ju52 to appear over Britain.

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"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson

I have visited Shingle Street about 3 times. Its a remote place, with a strange atmosphere.
Anyway, i hope this link helps.
www.shford.fslife.co.uk/ShingleSt/

There never was an invasion of any sort on the coast of Britain, had there been, and if it had been "Covered up" it would have soon got out....

The coast was watched everwhere...
As to the beaches on fire, there definately were places where oil pipes had been run out into the sea, Theses would have been ignited as the supposed invasion fleet were about to land.

No foreign troops set foot on Britains coast during the war...Only if they been captured.
Brian.

Yes, Hoppy's link is very interesting and everyone loves a mystery...

But when you start to think about it, the story doesn't hold up. Why would the British Government 'cover up' a foiled invasion attempt ? Why would trainloads of burned survivors be taken all the way to Berlin ? And so on....

But Sapper's right - beaches and sea areas were 'fired' ; there is a photo of such an exercise on the dustwrapper of Peter Fleming's 'Invasion 1940' for instance.

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"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson

Just to throw another spanner in the works,
at the same time, in Germany, the German radio stations told the people of a 'Glorious attempt to probe the defences of Britain' in which the 'British cowards set alight the sea, in an attempt to deter the brave forces of the Reich'.
So the Germans knew of something going on.....
But what ????

Sorry, i dont have the answer ! But i will keep looking.

I can see that I'm going to have to dig out that old copy of 'After The Battle' !

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"Stand by to pull me out of the seat if I get hit" - Guy Gibson

I recall only to well the German broadcasts during the war....Lord Haw Haw. Germany calling! Germany Calling. the greatest load of lies ever.
Fortunately, we hung Lord Haw Haw by the neck in the tower of London. Yippee!
Sapper

This was broadcast to the German troops, not to the British.
Theres too much that is left to question to say that it 'did' or 'didnt' happen for certain. Something has been covered up, but why ?

I have a contact who was a serving member in the German forces, i will try and get some feedback from them.

Hi Hoppy Not a chanve old mate..... There was no invasion of the British Isles.

We would have known about it.
Sapper

I quite agree sapper, there was no invasion. However, IF there was an incident, we are talking of a Commando style raid, not a full blown invasion.
Something happened on the coast in Suffolk, of that i am pretty sure. As to what happened, i just dont know. Was it a raid ? was it an allied accident ?
I dont know if you have read the entire website in the link (an awful lot of reading) but it is worth it.
All the Police notes of that time (kept at Martlesham Heath (near Ipswich)are complete, EXCEPT those of the date in question.
Anyway, yes you are right, there was no Invasion.
The invasion would have been Sealion and we all know this didn't take place.
Also, i have just found out that the German forces who found out about a seaborn defeat, found out on Military Comms radio, NOT a German broadcast . Apparently it was publicly denied, but as previously stated, German forces heard about an 'incident' in which they lost troops .

[ 30. November 2003, 05:12 PM: Message edited by: Hoppy ]

http://www.batsford.com/book/1861057504

Where the Eagle Landed
The Mystery of the German Invasion of Britain, 1940
By Peter Haining

Don´t know much about the author but he might be coming up with the idea that the "killed and wounded Germans" were British soldiers dressed up as Germans who were "pretending to make an invasion" and things went horribly wrong.

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The title of this thread was
"Was WWII mystery a fake?"
My answers still the same.
YES.

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if in doubt....Panic!!!!

In answer to this question, I believe the Dutch destroyed most of the Ju-52's when Germany invaded Holland. Notice that German airborne assaults did not occur in the France campaign or in the Russia campaign, primarily due to a lack or shortage of transports.

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If dogs don't go to heaven, I'd like to go where they go.

Er... No.

The GErmans lost around 400 JU-52s in Holland and Norway.

Why werent they used in France? Er... Look at the dates for the landings in Holland and Belgium! The airborne strikes breached the canal and Eben Emael pushing forward the Northern German spearhead. Their use was in direct support of the attacks on France. It further gave the impression that Germany would attack France via the Low Countries.

As for Russia... Perhaps you forgot Operation Mercury? The capture of Crete? If as you say no airborne attacks were launched due to a lack of transport then what about Crete in May 1941!!!

German airborne operations put immense strain on the Transport Fleets. The German need to secure an airfield by drops and the use of airlanded troops meant that many Ju-52s were damaged when airfields could not be secured and they had to land at any available place. Heavy losses were sustained to the transport fleets in all German operations but the more serious losses occured in trained pilots for the training establishments.

The reason for no airborne assaults in Russia are due mainly to the heavy losses of the Fallschirmjager on Crete rather than any losses in aircraft, though it has to stated that their need is debatable in Barbarossa. Brandenburg units seemed to have secured most key bridges with just as much success. I dont believe that Barbarossa really require the FJ use hence the willingness of Hitler to allow their use in an operation that was expected to sustain heavy losses from the outset.

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"Watch that Fu*ker, he'll 'ave someones eye out!" King Harold at Hastings 1066.