Discussion in 'Eastern Europe October 1939 to February 1943' started by Class of '42, Apr 27, 2020.
Lets keep this civil folks, debate the subject, not your personal opinions on other members.
Soviet State Arcives are now western propaganda...Who knew?
Gulags were actually Club Meds.
The NKVD were actually clowns to entertain Soviet citizenry.
Katyn...That was the Germans.
That's the Soviet line...right.
Hitler & Stalin...cut from the same cloth.
One is to be held in contempt, and one is to be praised...according to Tamino.
Yet, their crimes were the same.
So, how do you tell them apart?
Yes it was a disaster for the Germans and a victory for the Russians..and I'll leave it at that...time to move on.
Put the above text in your signature and then you may reply to anything without typing even a letter. All you have to do is just to press two buttons: "Reply" and "Post Reply". The above is all you say all the time and .... in any instance.
Both the Russians and the Germans fought valiantly and courageously in defense of their homelands.
Relativization isn't helpful when dealing with particular cases. In Stalingrad Germans were aggressors with blood on their hands, except if you assume that the final frontier of Germany is the Arhangelsk-Astrakhan line. Furthermore, it is impossible to blame the Russians for miserable end of these 90.000 who surrendered. They already were half dead on arrival of the Red Army. What should the Soviets do: reward the Fritzes with accommodation in five-star hotels?
Moaning over their graves is pure ideological bluf.
The Germans were the aggressors (against a genocidal entity) and still, the Germans fought valiantly and courageously in defense of their homeland. That was what they sincerely believed.
The Art. 7 of the Hague IV Convention said: "prisoners of war shall be treated as regards board, lodging, and clothing on the same footing as the troops of the Government who captured them."
There wasn't any "except the Germans" or "only if you can afford it" there.
So yes, what the Soviets did to those soldiers was a massive war crime.
We can certainly describe the loss at Stalingrad as a "disaster" from the German perspective without apology. This isn't a referendum on whether the Nazis were aggressor, or if they were the bad guys or not.
Please continue with the discussion here. We shouldn't have any hurdles going forward.
After further review and other considerations, I have decided this will be my last post in this forum. For some have labeled me some type of nazi sympathizer or close it because I have a historian interest about the Eastern Front??? ..have had interest about WWII since I was a kid and thought I would share some insights...for my family served in three generations of military service including myself but a nazi sympathizer??...ok whatever...so with that said I am gone in here ..adios but always aim high.
Don't mind Tamino...he's harmless and as always, every village has it's idiot. Once in a great while, he actually does say something intelligent, but don't hold your breath waiting for it.
I for one, don't see you as a Nazi sympathizer...far from it.
From time to time we've had people like Tamino post similar rants. I have often wondered "what if"...these same people had been born in Germany in say, 1920, how would they have performed. Would they have been so morally pure as they seem now or would they have had shining careers in the SS? Judging people in another time, place and society, if you think about it, is fraught with peril. The best we can do is learn from history and try hard not to repeat it.
A much simpler solution is what I do, a judicious use of the ignore function. It is easily available to you at this site...one of the best things is it also edits out notifications when the blocked person replies to something you posted. With the ignore function you can easily edit the monkey gallery out of your feed, while still getting the commentary with actual content from the non-mouth breathers.
Yes, the Germans got what they deserved under Hitler´s command. Anyway, why did Stalin make the Ribbentrop-Molotov pact in 1939 dividing Europe to halves with Hitler? For world peace?? In 1991 Russia publicly announced they shot the Mainila gun shots due to which the USSR attacked Finland. Before that they had invaded the Baltic countries "for their own safety". And invaded half of Poland because it was not "protected by own army".
Everybody says it was a sudden attack to Finland in late November 1939. Just how long do you think it takes to move a million Red Army soldiers, many tanks, artillery pieces,planes among the Finnish border line. One day? Just try. The USSR broke the non-aggression pact the same day 30th Nov 1939 when they attacked Finland. Originally it was signed to last until December 1945.