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Italian Paras during Market Garden?

Discussion in 'Western Europe 1943 - 1945' started by JCFalkenbergIII, Sep 6, 2008.

  1. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    "Those paras were probably from Nembo Division. A full regiment of Nembo went over to the Germans. Most of them ended up as the cadre for the 14th Falschirm., however, at least one parachute recce company (if memory serves, also from Nembo) ended up with the 2nd Falschirm. at Market Garden. They were equipped with Italian recon vehicles but wore German uniforms."

    Someone in another forum brought this up. Is this true and is there some more infomation on this?

    [TMP] "Italian Paras that fought in Operation Market Garden?" Topic
     
  2. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    So far I vcant find anything on any members serving in the 2nd Falschirm.


    "184th Division Parachutists Nembo was constituted in 1943 like the second Division Parachutists with the employment of new units and 185° the Regiment of the Folgore . The Nembo was sent on the evening of 8 September 1943 to Sardinia where it was decimated by malaria. Survivors formed the core of the German 4th Parachute Division.
    Reraised but the 12/183rd in the War of Italian liberation it fought in the battles of Filottrano, Grizzano Houses and in Operation Herring (these last ones in the Group of Combat Folgore , from it constituted after the reconfiguration of the Division due to the losses endured)."

    Paracadutisti - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
     
  3. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    "The first new unit to be formed was the Italian Parachutists Volunteers Group, formed by elements of the ADRA, 10th Arditi Rgt, 17th, 18th and 20th "Ciclone" Battalions, 12th and 8th "Nembo" Battalions and a replacement unit of the "Nembo" then training at Viterbo. Renamed Parachutist Group "Nembo", the unit was assigned to the 2nd Fallschirjaeger Div. One company of the 10th Arditi Rgt entered too in the 2nd FJ as its reconnaissance units, and followed this German Division in Russia and then in Holland, where it fought in the Market Garden operation"

    War and Game: RSI Paratroop Units
     
  4. PzJgr

    PzJgr Drill Instructor

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    this is very interesting. Thanks JC
     
  5. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    Thanks. I hope someone else may have some more info on this. Over on TMP this has cause a little dispute. :(
     
  6. TheRedBaron

    TheRedBaron Ace

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    The only RSI paras that fought with FJ after 1943 were a handful that fought on the Eastern Front.

    in Italian Armour in German Service, 1943–1945, Daniele Guglielmi drove a stake into this one using (gasp!) actual sources. There were Italians in the 2.Fallschirmjäger-Division's recon abteilung; they did have six Saharianas when they deployed to the Eastern Front (Guglielmi provides a previously unpublished photo of two of them [on p. 19] to go along with the better-known one that crops up occasionally in photo histories); but they lost all six before they re-deployed to the west -- they don't show up on any of the sample unit returns Guglielmi reproduces or any of the summary reports he compiled from sources. I've never seen them reported in original sources for Normandy or Market-Garden (or mentioned in secondary summaries, such as those compiled by Zetterling), and I've never seen a single verified photograph of a Sahariana in 2.Fallschirmjäger-Division service after their re-deployment from the East. I'd be very skeptical until someone produces more convincing evidence for the vehicles' existence than Guglielmi presents for their absence.
     
  7. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    So far the only additional info posted on TMP has been this,

    " But i clearly remenber quotes from Nino Arena book..this guy, that i interviewd years ago here in Rome…while having been himself a parachutist and fought with RSI forces is the semiofficial and must appreciated Italian historian on both Folgore and RSI armed forces. In one of his books he mentioned Arnhem and also published a pict of a Sahariana car with 20mm HMG and para crew. Same info are mentioned in the multivolume "Gli ultimi in grigio verde"by Pisanò..another semiofficial history of RSI forces."

    [TMP] "Italian Paras that fought in Operation Market Garden?" Topic
     
  8. wtid45

    wtid45 Ace

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    Been wondering if there was any more info on this? just saw MEDIC and MARTIN are online anything to add guys:)
     
  9. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    I still havent been able to find out much more :( .
     
  10. wtid45

    wtid45 Ace

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    Hey JC, have to hit the books on this me thinks, it has really peaked my curiousty since i saw the post now all i need is my kids to go to bleeding bed at night so i can auctually read a book;)
     
  11. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    Im gonna have to hit them too. I too am curious as to what is out there on them.
     
  12. airborne medic

    airborne medic Member

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    Can't say I've ever heard of any Italians fighting on the German side at Arnhem...but certainly possible.....I do recall a Garibaldi in the 10th Parachute Battalion- does he count?
     
  13. Mussolini

    Mussolini Gaming Guru WW2|ORG Editor

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    lol. History is odd like that. I remember seeing a Scottish name on that Arc d'triumph or whatever it is called in Paris.
     
  14. wtid45

    wtid45 Ace

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    With cracks like that me thinks you been round Martin to long;):D
     
  15. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    Well so far no luck :(. I guess it may be one of the mysteries and rumors of war.
     
  16. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    Since there is a few people with knowledge on the Italians posts I thought I would bump this up and see if they have any more info :).
     
  17. JackSEWing

    JackSEWing Member

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    mm never heard about that.
    i will ask to some ex paratroopers that i know and look in some italian website
     
  18. JackSEWing

    JackSEWing Member

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    ok :)

    Nice find JC! it's confirmed that the 4a Fallshirmjager division was full off italian volunteers, so it's historically confirmed the use of italians in german's parachute units.

    also, this book Basco Grigioverde: I ragazzi che riscattarono l'Onore, talks about italian involvment during Market Garden, 10° Regiment Arditi Paracadutisti as you wrote before
     
  19. airborne medic

    airborne medic Member

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    JackSEWing,

    Can you please add a bit....or pm me.....

    Where abouts did they fight at Arnhem...by this the Oosterbeek pocket, in the woods, the town.....
    I don't suppose that book has been translated into english????
     
  20. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    Thanks Jack!!! If you could post more info it would be greatly appreciated :).
     

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