List of "Elite" units

USMCPrice;

Hello BP,

well this thread is about who is elite - so I think it is okay to continue as long we don't get to heated up

The LRRP is a part of the KSK - in that case the German Army is organized differently from the US Forces. However the KSK lacks the "strategical and technical backup" in comparrison to the US SOF's. But they are in the same trade as the SEAL's.

On that part I have to respectfully disagree. Schw. was totaly against the preliminary deployment of SOF's. It was French and British LRRP's that went in before the action got under way. It was only opon opening the battle that Schw. moved in SOF's. Later he corrected his estimates towards them.

Exactly, 5th SFG were the first to send in LRRP teams. The German LRRP and the "OD Alpha" have a very solid cooperation since more then 40 years now. And we still train our units at the same school and camp.

I think were we differentiate is within the setup of the SEAL's. They have their own so called LRRP's, which is one of the headaches of SOCOM and SOCJFCOM in regards to DEVGRU (T6) since their LRRP is not in the same league as other LRRP's. But I think now it is getting too technical

I just wanted to point out that units such as SEAL, SAS or KSK are the broader outline of elite units - the real elite IMHO are the Lurp's.

Regards
Kruska

Hello Mod , I hadn't relized that this "elite" was about WWII - sorry

 

I am actually not all that interested at the designated "elite" units such as the Airborne, Rangers, Commandos and Bradenburgers because they were created for special operations and composed of picked men. I would like to add to the question: among conventional infantry and armor divisions, what units were reckoned to be "elite" or "crack" outfits? According to whose esteem? For example, I found this curious aside on the US 30th Division's vet association:

"Towards the end of the war General Eisenhower asked the European Theater historian to rate all the division in the European Theater of Operations. The 30th participated prominently and effectively in all five major battle campaigns in Northern Europe. After a thorough study by the historian staff the 30th Infantry Division was rated the No.1 Division in the ETO by these historians. It was judged overall to have outperformed the acclaimed airborne and regular army divisions. This is the legacy we wish to carry forward."

Has anyone else heard of this investigation? Does anyone have a copy of this report? Also of great interest to me: according to the Wehrmacht, what conventional Allied Divisions in ETO was thought to be particularly dangerous?

 

Hello Triple C,

I certainly can't speak for the estimation of the Wehrmacht leadership as such - but from vetrans accounts the answer would be;

Any Western Allied unit was feared due to the amount of backup that was behind them. As such it didn't really matter to them Wehrmacht guys - what name that specific US or Brit/Canad unit had.

Foremost the Allied tank units were the more fearsome expression in contra to infantry unit - due to their backup and order of battle. Once the term "Ami Panzer" US tanks, was called everone started to look for a hole somewhere.

Regards
Kruska

 

Aye, I was just done reading an account of the Ruhr Pocket constructed from mostly German sources. I can see why the German Landsers had a contemptuous opinion of the American and British infantrymen's quality. Namely the Allies usually refused to come into grips with Wehrmacht troops in close combat but would return fire with heavy weapons that German troops did not possess and could not retaliate. The German civilians and soldiers alike were impressed with the number of tanks and the destructiveness of the artillery.

The only quotation of Eisenhower's opinion of American infantry divisions I can source mentioned the 1st and 9th Divisions as they were the most seasoned. But I am still looking for the evaluation mentioned in the 30th Division's history.

 

I notice alot of vets in this thread. Thank you for your service gentlemen.

 

How about the Navy NCDU's , UDT's and the US Navy Scouts and Raider's?

And I believe that the USMC Parachute Bn's have been left out, despite the fact they never were used in an Airborne role and were realitively short lived I believe they should be considered an elite.

 

Free French Kieffer Commando
In 1944, the 177 men of the "1er BFM Commando" were integrated into the British No. 4 Commando under Lieutenant-Colonel Dawson, part of the 1st Special Service Brigade under Brigadier Lord Lovat.

On 6 June 1944, at 0731, the Bérets verts ("Green berets") landed in Ouistreham, Benouville, Amfreville and Bavant, designated as Sword Beach. Kieffer, recently promoted to capitaine de corvette, led his men personally. The unit suffered 21 killed and 93 wounded; Kieffer himself was almost immediately wounded twice, hit by shrapnel in the leg, but refused evacuation for two days. Kieffer rejoined his unit on 14 June

Philippe Kieffer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

WEB Griffin's series Semper Fi is fiction although it goes into detail over the Marine Raider issue and the conflict it caused in the Marines. That issue has continued even into today with the implementation of MARSOC the newest slant on Elite Forces.

 

Griffin's books are fiction but well grounded in fact. The guy must do a tremendous amount of reasearch. As for MARSOC most of the controversy resulted over the fact that the Marine Corps didn't really want to play the whole special operations forces game nor give up operational control of it's units. Their Force Recon units should be considered special operations forces by nature of selection, training, employment and capabilities but because they weren't under SOCOM they weren't considered so. The Marine Corps made the very valid argument that their MEU(SOC)'s were trained up to standard and could perform many special operations type missions. They could do anything the Ranger Units (considered special operations forces) could do except for airborne ops and many things the Rangers lacked the capabilities to do but once again because they didn't fall under SOCOM they weren't considered special operations forces but the Marine Corps added the SOC (Special Operations Capable) to MEU's so trained. In the end the Marine Corps lost the political fight and stood up the MARSOC units, unfortunately to fill their personnel requirements they initially had to deplete the active duty and reserve Force Recon units. The Marine Corps Expeditionary Forces still needed the capabilities provided by the Force Recon units so they were stood back up using qualified Battalion Recon personnel and through increasing the numbers of personnel selected and placed in the training pipeline.

 

One of my buddies in the Navy had been on the ground, Corpsman, in "Indian Country" in 73-74 and operated in an area with Gurkas. He had the utmost respect for their fighting abilities!
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Fallschirmjaeger:

[video=youtube;qo_E6qOIcnM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qo_E6qOIcnM&feature=related[/video]



This would only be the start of my list.

 

Doesn't the USMC consider themselves to be the elite?

(And they've made a damn fine case for themselves.)

 

Yes maam, and most people don't realize there were more U.S. Airborne regiments in WWII than there were Marine Corps Infantry regiments.

 

What about the Japanese, Didnt they have any elite forces ?.
I cant belive that no one has mentioned Darby's Rangers (or maybe they have and I should have worn my reading glasses).
Regards Yan.

 

You better get new glasses! Many people have mentioned the US Rangers. "Darby's" Rangers was the unofficial nickname of the the 1st Ranger Battalion.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperial_Guard_(Japan)

Regards,

 

During the Malayan Campaign they didn´t exactly distinguish themselfs. The Guard was a parade ground unit.