the ultimate weapon , 1940

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Reading A, Beevor the spanish civil war ...I had a though

He describe the battles ( with tanks ) as little more than a frontal push of all arms,
the more unexperienced , the commanders the more bull headed the push , any frilly movement inevitably ended in a mess , defense, being the easiest to manage with brave, inexperienced units fighting and dying on the same spot

The weapon of the blitzkrieg wasn't the tank or the Stuka , it was the radio

For the first time a battle was managed in real time , all weapons being used not as per an agreed plan but as a flexible operation ,
the whole trust could be shifted , ressources diverted , objectives evaluated and modified as conditions revealed themselves ,
the plan becoming in fact the starting position .

For the old style headquarters it must have been like a blind man fighting against
a sharp eyed opponent with lightning reflexes ,

This idea should be easily to demonstrate , by comparing the number of radio sets in operation at the point of attack .

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the germans forsaw this and had lots of radios in their panzer units which allowed them to react quickly and coordindate well.

Added to that the officers in charge of the panzer divisions were also very far up and in a position to not only see the battle but to influence it.

FNG

 

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Yes I was thinking of Rommel crossing the Meuse , his command vehicle was equipped with four radio sets and on the second day he changed an attack in a matter of minutes , the French needed nearly a day to react , never mind coordinating an air strike !

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that was the advantage the germans had also in operation barbarossa, all gemans tanks where equipped with radios, while the russians only 1 in 5 did, due that fact the usa send millions of vacuum tubes among other thing to russia
but you must see the fact that while you can coordinate attack/ defense movements, some one can be listening to you, hence the creation of codes

 

Radio and an Enigma machine was a deadly combination, that is to say until the Brits cracked the Enigma code.

 

Well, the Poles did really, we inherited their research and machinery and built on that.

 

I forgot about the Poles. The cryptanalyst team at Bletchly Park did most of the routine code breaking throughout the war however.

 

You should never forget the Poles - otherwise your tent will fall down.

 

subject

You could always call in the 'Maquis!
"Don't call us, we'll call you".
Simon Cowel. Britain's got Talent! :roll:

 

did frontline forces use code for battlefield radio communications?

from unit to unit, unit to commander, commander to group commander?

The reason I ask is that code machines in WW2 were either bulky sensative machines like the enigma or code book based. Both slowed down communications and would seem to be inpracticle in battle situations.

FNG

 

As far as I know they just used plain speech, but with code words, in an effort to prevent intrerceptions from being acted on immediately.

eg:

"Blue Rug to Pink Carpet, moving into Sockville now"

Which would mean

"Commanding Officer of [unit] reporting to [higher authority], we are advancing on [target area] now"

 

We had Navaho code-talkers in the Pacific campaign... no need for cipher machines. The Japanese never had a clue what they were saying, and no chance to ever break that code. (Short of capturing a Navaho and torturing him.)
A brilliant solution and purely "native American" to boot.

Of course the British had Irish Brougue. (I never could understand that speak.) Maybe the Germans couldn't either. Or, perhaps a company of Druid code-talkers...


Tim

 

We actually have used Welsh speakers for this.

I often wonder what the Welsh (or Navaho) is for 'tank' or 'aeroplane' or even 'machinegun'

 

post

The QDG used Welsh in the Gulf.

 

The Navahos who fought in the Pacific war didn't have any words in their language to describe tanks etc. so they made them up. They named tanks, turtles. Planes were owls, and bombs were the eggs.

I'm not making this up either!

 

so did the Japanese

 

essentially all modern words are made up to fit old languages.

Until someone invented a machine gun there was no word for machine gun in English. But for a twist of fate it could have been called a mechanical gun, an automated bullet thrower or even a wand of doom.

the israelies have committies making up words for hebrew to avoid using western universal equivalents like television or phone

FNG

 

I can see it now...

The WoD42 Wand of Doom has a rate of fire of 1,200 rpm, compared to the Browning .5 Wand of Doom, (etc etc)

 

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Most language structure have been set in the neolithic age , the vocabulary is only the bit of fluff added to it , I have a tip for you in Navaho the word for pizza is pizza

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It's a bit of an oversimplification to say that all battles before the invention of the field radio were just mass clashes of formations without any direction and without changes to the preconceived plan. This is how Hollywood tends to depict such battles, but it is hardly a reality in cases where at least some degree of professionalism was applied to the armed forces. Of course, the Spanish Civil War is a bad example in this case because the armies involved were mostly made up of irregular troops.

Before field radios, commanders used drums, flags, banners, gongs, bells, horns and a variety of other visual or audible signals to inform their troops of commands and changes. Throughout history there have been armies that achieved their victories because of their renowned ability to manoeuver rapidly and effectively during battle - the Spartans, for instance, were actually capable of changing the direction of their phalanx, something the other Greek city states could only marvel at. They marched and followed orders to the sound of flutes. The Swiss made up for the vulnerability of the flanks and rear of a pike formation by being masters at disciplined manoeuvre.