What if Japan invaded mainland America?

It didnt work too well for the Germans in Poland and maybe it woulda killed a lot more Frenchman if the Czecks didn't assasinate Reynherd Heydrich who if I remember correctly was going to France to deal with the resistance but was killed before he could begin his departure.

 

i kinda think the germans and the japanese coulda pulled it off if they worked together

 

Not a chance. Any reasoning behind this?

 

The Japanese could have destroyed the Panama Canal or put it out of commision for a length of time, up until they lost their Carrier advantage.

 

I'm with Simon on this. Didn't we have another thread on this subject?
Before one concludes that either Japan or Germany could have invaded mainland America one needs to consider all the elements that would be needed in order to mount an operation on this scale and at the great distances involved. i.e. air power, sea power, occupation forces, logistics etc.
I won't list them all here unless someone wants to seriously debate this topic and provides a reasonably plausible scenario.

 

Given the generally crappy state of US coastal defenses up until about 1942, any invasion force has the potential to actually get there unobserved.

However...

1) The journey there

German forces would have to get past the UK first. Any large fleet sent out by the Germans would receive the full weight of the Home Fleet and would shortly be dispatched. Barring miracles.

Japanese forces would have a better chance of getting to the USA... in theory. In order to have the necessary forces to mount an invasion of any size They would have to cut back elsewhere, which means fewer Allied bases destroyed, fewer naval units sunk, fewer aircraft shot down, so more hazardous for the invasion fleet.

2) Logistics

Both Germany and Japan are the wrong side of quite large oceans for attacking the USA. Having used all available merchant shipping to land their invading troops, both nations would then need to send them home, fill them with more men, more equipment, more supplies, then sail back to the USA. It would take over a month before the invading soldiers could expect to see any backup. And, of course, the resupply mission is undertaken through very dangerous routes (especially for Germany).
And should, by some miracle, the ships return with their supplies and the invading forces still exist, how is it distributed to them? Bear in mind that the Allies in France had big problems supplying their troops when seperated by the English Channel, which is only 23 miles wide at its narrowest point, compared to ~3,000 miles for the Atlantic ocean.

3) Size of invasion

There is no way that Japan or Germany could spare enough ships to take an adequately-sized invasion force to the USA, and keep them adequately supplied. And that is before enemy action sinks any.

There is no way that Japan or Germany could spare enough troops to mount an adequately-sized invasion of the USA.



I think that is everything. Oh, yes, if Britain is taken out of the war, that still does not change points 2 or 3...

 

A pretty fair summary all told, the only thing I would probably disagree slightly with are:

They would have to cut back everywhere, infact they would probably have to postpone or cancel every other operation planned or carried up to that point. IIRC the Japanese landforces as a whole were pretty stretched as early on as early 1942 (In logistics at the very least, if not manpower too).

CBI, Phillipines, everywhere else in fact would have to be pared to the bone and left to its own devices to even attempt an attack on mainland USA.

 

i remeber reading a story of pilot who bombed mainland america. he used a plane launched from a sub. they bombed a forest on the west coast. it was the japanese high comand's plan to create a massive forest fire that would distroy the west coast.

on another note didn't the japanses invade an unpopulated alaskan island?

 

Yup, they did but it's 1) closer, 2) a place where the American fleet doesn't come and 3) no troops to fight against.

 

AFAIK the sub launched planes never actually carried out any such missions, although I stand ready to be corrected. Yes the Japanese did capture the Aleutians, it was intended as a decoy for the Midway operation to draw the US fleet out of the way in early stages. CINCPAC knew this and allowed the Aleutians operation to go ahead unhindered.

Overall the effect of the Aleutians operation was a big minus for Japan, not only did it divide the effort and take away ships from the main operation against Midway, it provided the US with their first intact example of an A6M2 Zeke, which when tested began to show the serious weaknesses in the Japanese navies main frontline fighter.

 

Right on both accounts.

The sub plane attack took place on Sept 9, 1942 against a forest near Brookings Oregon. It took the better part of a day before anyone realized there had been an attack.

The Aleutian islands of Attu and Kiska were occupied by the Japanese in June of 1942 as part of the Midway plan.

 

Yeah, who would want Attu and Kiska, save for the native Aleuts? And personally, if I were going to the trouble of sending a plane to drop bombs on the USA, I certainly would not waste them on a forest. I have had occasion to wonder, as I've read about some of their decisions, just what drugs the Japanese high commnad were on during WW2. :roll:

 

The seizure of Attu and Kiska were supposed to serve several functionss.

1) Provide a diversion to the US fleet during the Midway invasion.
2) Provide a sprnig board for future attacks against alaska dn the US northwest.
3) Prevent tue US from using the aleutians as a base from which to launch air attacks against eh empire, especailly Paramushiro.
The US did indeed consdier basing B-29s in the Aleutians is so bad that it never happened, espicailly after the Mariannas became available.

The forest fire scheme does fit into the kind of fantasy the Japanese often fell victim to during the war. The idea was that the fires would rage out of control and consume valuable resources if not outright destroy places like Seattle. Apparently they believed US construction and fire fighting to be on a par with Japanese.

 

Pity they were so wrong, eh?