More Luftwaffe signatures

Really pleased today to add the autograph of Hermann Graf to my collection.

It's only on a first-day cover, but his signature isn't an easy one to find and I had it very cheaply indeed via e-bay. Also, it was signed in 1973 when his writing was very clear.

An interesting man......

 

Martin I was looking at your next to last posting with the great frontage of the Fw 190A. Spoke and wrote to several of those aces now all gone.......

congrats on the last e-bay purchase as that is an excellent "grab"

just was looking through some old Nachtjagd files and hiding in their were three III./NJG 5 members signatures to me, one an RK winner another an ace with 6 kills. I await Simon Schatz's profile of Ju 88G-6 with Neptun FuG 217 radar, coded C9+AR in black codes and night ground attack dress. Will apply these 3 friends sigs when the profile comes.

Simon is planning on more 88G-6 profiles after his stint with Classic pubs going on right now.

Martin, by the way our friend Peter S. is moving to an "old home" residence as he calls it in his typical humor as their place is a bit overwhelming now for the two of them after their 4 kids left the house

E ~

 

i envy you martin....you are lucky...

 

Not lucky, fortune - just vigilant on e-bay !

Erich, I'd noticed that Peter has been quiet on the internet lately - hope all's OK with him.....

 

Here´s one from the local auction net. He flew, it seems, with the "Sturmbock" FW 190 group.

http://chesterfieldarmament.com/bailey/warwolf/warwolf.htm

Any idea what would be a reasonable price for this one? Thanx!

 

Oscar Boesch is, I believe, happily still with us. This is not a rare signature so although nice to have, value in the UK would be about £10 ( the frame would probably add another £5 or so.... )

 

Gents I have known ace Oskar Bösch since 1992. He has helped me greatly in many ways understanding his 11th and late 14.Sturm/JG 3 unit that he flew with.

The painting is incorrect in the markings. His mount that he he is getting on is a A-8/R2 with cowl mg's and the photo is in August of 44 as I own a personalized copy from him besides his personal portrait. Oskar still flys gliders in Canada as well as the east coast of the US of A and it is a rareity to have him come to my west coast surroundings. Oskar being one of now two surviving members of Sturmstaffel 1, the other is Richard Franz who survived through the same staffels as Oskar and then a transfer to Bf 109's in JG 11 till wars end fighting the Soviets

 

Those are great pics congradulations!!! But can someone pleae tell me why is it that the west views the Germans as some kind of heroes? If you ask anyone in the East they were all NAZIS. All of the Germans in the pics might of been great pilots but they were also all NAZIS, that were loyal to Hitler and believed in him and his views along with all Germans at the time in Germany, in you didnt believe in the Riech then you were imprisoned.

But Martin all said and done they really are great photos and prized possesions and they were great pilots.

 

Whoa pard you are beleiving a lie I can assureyou . I had at least 6 relatives serving in the Luftwaffe and Heer, none of them NAZIS as you call them. They served their country not an outsider Austrian. In fact each one of them through their war time writings gave acct to that effect, they were in a war created by a corrupt regime

If you would have the chance and sit down with Oskar B. you would also find the same of him. Heros that is alot of B.S. I can tell you. Oskar is an honest man, the prime reason for joining up into the new Sturmsatffel 1 at a young age was revenge against the US heavy bomber formations, not the men within the machines ( I had a hard time trying to accept his concept but do now ). Oskars parents were killed in an air raid in Köln.

A very important and much overlooked point was either serve or never see your family again and you maybe not serve on the Ost front that everyone would like to imply, but off to the camp(s). It was regular enough, missing men in action were not always through military means

 

I'm not going to 'go there' with this - earlier this year on another forum I was virtually accused of being a Fascist sympathizer for being photographed shaking hands with an ex-Luftwaffe nightfighter pilot ....

For my part, there is no 'hero worship' but I respect the achievements of these men as combat pilots - and if it looks one-sided, see elsewhere on this forum for discussions of my collection of 8th AF and Bomber Command aircrew ( come to think of it, there are probably people around who would think of them as 'war criminals'.... depends on your POV )

My collection contains no autographs of Nazi ( or other totalitarian ... ) politicians, Allgemeine SS, Gestapo etc etc.

 

Martin

By no means did I inteded to make it sound that I thought u were a fascist or a sympathiser. Like I said I respect their accomplishments as well, after all they were good pilots. And even the Russians till this day respect the Germans in their fighting abilities, afterall its in their blood.

Erich,

lol you know that when Russians during WW2 captured German soldiers they all said that they werent NAZIS I guess they only used that term when it suited them huh?? not a chance!!!!! Before the war and in the opening days it was a privaledge to serve in the German war machine whether u were a pilot or infantryman but you had to be a fascist to do so!!! Sorry Erich im not buying it. But ur relatives might very well been great pilots.

 

.......NONE of my relatives were fascists/nazis
get over it will ya

you have started a personal attack towards my familie of which I take great offense !

Erich

 

Gents - I think we should step back a little here and gain some perspective before unnecessary offence is taken which can only be damaging to this Forum.

As we should all by now be aware , the question of how an entire civilized Nation can follow a criminal regime to destruction is highly complex but possibly one of the most important lessons the 20th Century holds for us.

The 'only good German is a dead one' argument may have appeared valid in 1945 but over 60 years later we should be able to discuss such things without labelling individuals ( after all, few - if any - Nations emerged from WWII with clean hands ).

Anyhow - this is a 'Militaria' thread so the argument may best be carried on elsewhere.....

 

Indeed!

I agree totally with Martin! We are not here to condemn anyone and btw this has already been done in Nuremberg 1945. Please let it be!

 

Erich my apologies you are correct. Upon further research I have relized that during the war there was a draft and everyone was called up. What I should of said was that if you were in the Gastapo, SS or Walfen SS and organizations like that then you were a Nazi. But just cause you were a German soldier doesnt mean you were. So in my conclusion I say that I was mistaken and im not afraid to admit it. Erich your a good man and im sorry if I offended you and your family.

 

done and accepted.

one of my cousins serving in the day time Tagdjagd who flew an Fw 190A-9 served in blindflying and day flying schule in summer of 44, upon completion of this he was sent to JG 301 serving in the 5th staffel of II. gruppe. The "kid" had flown maybe 2 missions in November, the last on 26 November 44 in which he was shot down in action by P-51's and KIA south of Misburg.
In 1944 the Luftwaffe was not interested in pro-party feelings but was interested in any male youth that had some training to come forward and battle the US Viermots(4-motors), and at any cost.

# cousins lost on the Ost front in the Army did basic training in 41-42 and sent into the thick of the fighting all 3 in different divisions, 2 killed during the war, the last and youngest died enroute home from a Soviet prison camp. One other that served in the army actually retreated with his surviving kompanie which dissolved into small 4-man sections with weapons and fled into the west through Allied lines, dumped gear tunics and proceeded to find civilian clothing. And melded into the ever present chaos after war of 45 to get back to the Pfalzland and continue mending the destroyed grape vineyards which has made the area world known today.......

just a little something extra

 

Erich that a sad story unfortunetly I can relate with my grandparents who made it though the war told me similar stories of grief, so know what you mean.

 

Just got this for a very decent price. Hope it´s real...you never know until you get it in your hands even what the seller says...

 

Looks nice... who is it?

 

It's Oberstleutnant - later General der Jagdflieger - Werner Molders.

( If it were signed, it would be worth a bundle of money.... )