Science fiction AFVs

The Rebels knew they weren't going to win that fight. The goal of the Speeders and the resistance in the trench was only to slow the advance of the Imperial walkers. Naturally, the Speeders would serve as a better distraction to the enemy than the entrenched forces. The Speeders were simply drawing fire while the heavy guns set up at the Trench attempted to suppress the Walkers. As you can see, the plan failed. Only two Walkers were knocked out during the battle; the first of which was blown up by some idiot Speeder jock while his own infantry was trying to secure the wreck, costing his own side 50-100 men. The second was a fluke.

 

Oops, typo there. The second was a Luke. Sorry, I had to do this.

 

One final Star Wars AFV question - why don't the Rebels have any?

 

Because they were dumb, and would rather rely on magic.

 

If you want dumb, check the military machine that defended the city of Zion in Matrix 3...

 

NOOOOOO!!!

Like: "There's a whole bunch of them coming through the gap, but let's all shoot at the single ones that skid to the sides!" What were they thinking?!

Or the sentinels themselves, flying around in nice patterns and waves but never actually going anywhere...

Ugh.

 

Same reason you didn't see the Taliban with T-80s.

 

The Rebel Alliance simply can't afford them. Being a rebellion, they don't have a whole lot of access to such weapons; I'm surprised that they have as many starfighters as they do. Much, if not most, of their equipment is not what would be considered modern and up to date. This is a device used by George Lucas to emphasise the David and Goliath nature of the war between the Rebel Alliance and the Galactic Empire, as well as showing how the only way the Rebels can win is if the Jedi return. In terms of conventional warfare, the Alliance is simply too outnumbered and outgunned to win.

 

I have always loved the supertanks used in the "Hammer's Slammers" series created by David Drake (who lives not too far from me). These are mammoth iridium monsters able to withstand an enormous amount of punishment; they are also air cushion vehicles. They're powered by fusion bottles and armed with a 20cm main gun and a rapid firing 2cm tribarrel. The weapons are what he has styled "powerguns". They have iridium barrels and fire bolts of energy that are released from plastic discs which contain that energy prior to firing. The powergun rounds have no penetration whatsoever, but even a surface hit is devastating to whatever the target is. However, even hitting a leaf will set off a powergun bolt, so they do have to be careful about their fields of fire.

 

But they have Battlecruisers.
They have huge bases.
They have swarms (relatively) of modern starfighters.
Surely if they have that lot they can afford a few tanks?

And as they apparently got a fair few of their spacecraft from Imperial desertions, surely desertions of small units like AVFs would be more common...

 

Before Return of the Jedi the Rebel fleet was mostly made up of Bulk Cruisers, Corellian Corvettes, and Nebulon-B Frigates. It wasn't until the Empire attempted and failed an invasion of the planet Mon Calamari that the Rebels started getting capable warships in their fleet. Ships like the MC80, MC80B, and MC90 were all Mon Calamari cruisers that were almost as tough as Imperial Star Destroyers.

Rebel bases weren't exactly up to par with Imperial ones.

The Rebels don't possess swarms of modern fighters. The Y-Wing is very outdated. And until the X-Wing came along (Rebel sympathizers within the Incom corporation) the Y-Wing was the principle fighter of the Alliance.

The Rebels couldn't even use an AFV if they had access to them. Until the death of Emperor Palpatine, the Rebel strategy was always to harass outlaying Imperial outposts. It wasn't until after the events on ROTJ that the Rebel strategy switched over to taking and holding territory.

 

They did have the A-wing...

No, I'm just becoming bloody-minded now.

Yes, point taken, they were efectively guerillas, who have little use for AFVs.

But the bases they did have (like Hoth) would maybe have benefited from a mobile armoured force in defense?
They did have those SP artillery things (unfortunately not good enough, but they made a great exploding toy!).
Yes, most AFVs would have made sod-all difference against the AT-ATs, but at least they would buy extra time & stiffen the defenses...

 

Ok, simply because I couldn't resist...

The 'walkers' in Matrix 3.
This is a short list. Please feel free to add stuff!

1) No crew protection. Their main enemy (the sentinels) can easily reach past the framework and kill you.

2) ammo feed is so vulnerable to all kinds of crap that it just isn't funny.

3) ammo re-load system. More a planning fault than a AFV fault. Get some guy with a wheelbarrow to run out, protected by 2 people, against half a million sentinels???

4) a complete waste of resources for the armament it carries. Why not simply produce more gun turrets? Or use the saved metal to make a decent knitting machine...

5) How do you aim? You just wave your arm towards your enemy & fire??? Do you want to miss everything?

And as for the base defences / tactics...

1) The Biggie. You know that your best weapon against the bad guys is EMP. You know that they have potentially huge numbers, that can swamp your defenses. Therefore, it makes sense to have a 'last resort' of EMP. So why not have as many of your systems (especially the purely defensive stuff like turrets, etc) EMP-proof? Not very tricky. For example, use valves, not chips. Yes, they're bigger, but your turret is built into a building. All the electronics can be below the 'surface'.

2) Ammo-reload. See above.

3) Rockets using hand-ground gunpowder? wtf?

I can't go on. I'll start frothing at the mouth if I do.
:roll:

 

The A-Wings and B-Wings were gained during that explosion of support for the Rebelion after the failed invasion of Mon Calamari. As for stiffening defenses, thats what stationary guns are for.

 

Yeah, but a mobile reserve is a very useful asset in defense.
To:
- bolster a weak area
- perform limited counter attacks
- provide support where it is needed most, when it is most effective
- help contain (or slow down) any attacks that breach your defenses

Obviously, as said before, Rebel AFVs would be unlikely to achieve all that much against a determined Imperial assault...

 

The old ways

THE OLD WAYS

I think the way to stop AT-AT's would be the oldest anti tank method in the book, the venerable anti tank ditch.

Okay it would have to be the mother and father of all anti tank ditches and its not going to stop them forever but it will give you more time while their pratting around trying to blast ramps. (did anyone see an AT-AT with a big bundle of stick on it back?)

How would I make them? Explosives! Lay out lines of them around you base then blast them as neccessary and collect again if not needed.

 

Ohhh, an anti-AT-AT ditch.

Interesting. But maybe a little impractical.

Danyel?

 

Okay so you'd probably have to drill in the explosives but if you have access to spaceships a small drill rig should be than much of a problem and really you'd only have to block likely lines of advance

 

I think that would work nicely. Anything that walks can be brought down by simple imbalance, especially if it's the size and weight of the AT-AT...

Ricky, I don't know what was worse in Matrix 3: the weapons, or how they were used...

 

Roel, I think the whole 'final battle' scene was just cinematic rubbish.
Like so much screen warfare.

As a further example from Matrix 3...

When Neo & Trinity toddle off in their ship to enter the big machine city & battle the machine lord.

They come up a pipe, and arrive in one of the human 'battery farms' (excuse the pun). After a while flying along among the farming machines, they follow a very large cable which heads off from the farm towards the city, but then they come to a line of fortifications, which appear very effective and they are only saved by Neo's power.

Ok.
Surely it would serve the machines best to have put these defenses at the entrance to the pipe?
If I were the human commander, I would certainly have considered long & hard the possibility of launching a raid on the farm. Maybe knock out some farmers, or disconnect a few people. But, more than anything else, CUT THAT CABLE! A sudden huge loss of power & info to the machine city would create enough of a diversion that would allow for the launching of an attack that could potentially damage them enough to call a truce, or even destroy them altogether. If you could destroy enough cables, you could even 'pull the plug' completely.

Those farms were undefended. Militarily, criminal behaviour!