Sturmgewher 44 or Machine Pistolle 44?

The original name was the MP-43, designated as a machine pistol to hide the fact that it was fielded despite Hitler's dislike of the weapon. However, after Hitler realized how good it was, he renamed it the StG 44 as a propaganda move.

 

I do belive from when i was watching documentry the original manufactor name was the sturmgewher 44 but then to fit in with all over german weapons ie mp40 they changed its name and is catorgory ie rifle to sub-machine gun.

:aa_uk::flag_uk:

 

This discussion seems to be getting rather confusing, and indeed Sniper1946 has summed it up quite well.

However, I've gone back to my books and found my copy of Peter R. Senich's 'The German Assault Rifle 1935-1945' which gives the following info : -

The weapon we're discussing was originally given the nomenclature MP43 and MP43/1 ( itself a development of work on the Mkb42(H) ).

Albert Speer is recorded as giving the following details : in April 1944 it was decided to 'finalize' the nomenclature of three infantry weapons which were designated : -

a) MG42 to retain same designation.
b) The former self-loading rifle known as Gewehr 43 to receive designation Karabiner 43 ( K43 )
c) The former new MP known as the MP43 shall receive the designation MP44.

This order was promulgated on 6th April, 1944.

But yet another change occurred at the end of 1944. With the tide of war decisively turning against Germany, much propaganda effort was put into Hitler's new 'wonder weapons' which many ordinary Germans believed could yet ensure victory or negotiated peace.

So, in December 1944 shortly before the Ardennes Offensive, the official nomenclature of the MP 44 was changed to StG 44 - the name was intended to publicize the StG 44 as a 'special assault weapon' ( as opposed to any thought of a defensive weapon ). This name is certainly believed to have been personally chosen by Hitler, although no conclusive documentation has been found to support this.

 

Couldn't it just be both? Or maybe it's MachinePistol44 for us english types, and Sturmgweher44 (I spelled that wrong) for them Jerries.

 

Sometimes I wonder why I bother.

 

How many StG-44s were used by German forces in the Ardennes? My impression is not very many, but the Americans did record encountering some assault units accompanying StuGs that were almost completely equipped with this weapon. A few propaganda shots showed Waffen SS troops wielding a StG-44. Were they issued in lieu of MP-40 in some cases?

 

I had always been under the impression that the Sturmtruppen that accompanied assualt guns had almost exclussivly used the StG-44.

 

just to make this clear under official German documentation the MP 43 was not the later MP 44, there was subtle design changes to make the difference. Sturmtruppen associated with assault guns..........ah no that would be regular Landser even in 1945 whatever was to be had in the form of infantry. STG's were incorporated more and more trying to faze out the machine Pistol 40 that we know of, especially on the Ost front.

think Martin got his answer already on the other page ..........

v/r E ~

 

A minor mistake on my part, ive had a knack for calling the fast running infantry that follow assualt guns Stormtroopers.

 

yes i actually agree with chesehead121 (not in the terms of historical acuracy) but it ould be easier if it was like that

 

Actually, the MP43/1 has the most significant differences from the MP43, MP44 and StG44. The production order is as follows:
MKb42-series
MP43/1
MP43
MP44
StG44 (a few were marked MP45)

 

there was not a production difference between the MP 44 and the STG 44 as Germana documentation lists, it is one and the same weapon; it is also not the MP 45 either which is a different weapons system

 

I never said the MP44 & StG44 were different from each other. The MP43/1 is the standout from them and the MP43.

There were MP45 marked weapons from this series. One known example is in private hands and was reviewed in the books listed below. It was made in the summer of '44. Thus, it was marked MP45 assuming the simplified features would be introduced in '45 production runs. The features weren't adopted and the StG44 order came about a few months later. I suggest you at least purchase and read some of the recently published books on the subject before attempting to play an RKI on a firearm forum. Owning the real thing helps even more.

Recomended:
the already mentioned Assault Rifles 1939-1945 by Pete Senich
Sturmgewehr! by Hans-Dieter Handrich
The Propaganda Photo Series Vol IV The MKb 42, MP43, MP44, and the Sturmgewehr 44

 

c

 

Actual numbers issued are not known, possibly because records were later lost or destroyed. But a fair number were issued to Waffen-SS Panzergrenadiers and also certainly to the Fuhrer-Begleit Brigade. Certainly German propaganda made great play of the 'wonder weapon' ( it features prominently in the famous captured film shot at Poteau ) and it became a prized war trophy for US troops.

 

remember the late war Deutsche Wochenschau footage ? plenty of them issued to Fallshirmtruppen. my friend for many years noted that his Rgt 43 in the 1st Infantrie Div also were equipped in some fashion on the Preußian front

 

There is an excellent article in NOV 01 issue of Small Arms Review that discusses the combat performance of the 3rd & 5th FJ DIV during BOB.

I believe they still have copies left. http://www.smallarmsreview.com/images1/Vol5No2index.jpg

 

The 1st ID were involved going all the way back to the first MKb42(H) combat trials.

 

Actually, there also existed a Sturmgewehr-45, which was an even further simplified design. Even though parts for ca. 30 rifles were produced, it is highly unlikely that any StG-45 saw service before the end of the war.



Sincerely, D Evil

 

The StG-45 served as the basis for the German and Spanish weapons after the war, from CETME and Heckler and Koch.

The G3 bears much inner resemblance to the StG45.